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Civ 4 the List: Resources
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Created by:
Nikolai
Civ 4 the List: Resources
Introduction Resources are an important part of Civ. It was a big addition to Civ3. But how can it become better in Civ4? Summary Resources were not the most debated subject when making this list, but all participants seem to agree that it should stay. The general meaning seems to be that it should be expanded. The radical ideas was the most debated subject. The term Region will represent the terms region and state in this thread. Related Threads Resources: How to Handle Table of Contents 1 - General 2 - Food 3 - Syntetics 4 - Radical ideas 5 - Trade and stockpiling Conclusion The Ideas 1 - General 1.1 - List of resources Coffee Tobacco Sugar Vineager Copper (needed for some ancient and modern units Stone (Strategic - for wonders/improvements : eg. Pyramids, Hanging Gardens) -Mongoloid Cow Luxury: Resin Slaves Marble -Wernazuma III Cotton -DaleC76 RAW RESOURCES Horses (for mounted units) Iron (for many things) Coal (for RR's & PP's) KNO3 (Saltpeter) I prefer Sulfur instead (same use though) Rubber (many uses) - replaced later with component Synthetic Rubber Oil - replaced MUCH later with Synthetic Fuels Uranium - replaced MUCH later with a product of Fusion Power (MAYBE) Aluminum Timber (for building WOODEN larger ships) - available in any forest - if timber is added, then timber/stone would be needed for many buildings? Stone (for building structures) - available from any mountain/hill FINISHED GOODS Spears (no resource) - spearmen Pikes (Iron) - pikemen Muskets (Iron+KNO3) - musketmen Rifles (Iron+KNO3 or none) - riflemen Light Machine Guns(no resouce) -guerilla Machine Guns (Iron+rubber) - infantry Mech Inf (Rubber+Iron+Oil) -mech inf unit Swords (Iron) - swordsmen + med inf (sidenote: horsemen would be horse+spear, knights would be swords+horses, cavalry muskets/rifles+horses...) Tanks (Iron+Rubber+Oil) Fighter (Oil+Iron/Aluminum?) Galley (none) Frigate (Timber+Iron+KNO3) etc... -piratebrun 1.2 - Some units requiring resources to build Cameleers require desert terrain in the city to build. If you arent fighting in a desert, they have no particular advantage anyway. Elephants require the ivory spcial resource in your empire, and a jungle tile in the city (for a local habitat). Again, elephants, while good, arent essential. 'Large wooden ships' require a forest tile in the city radius. If you dont have forest, with the right tech, your terraformers can transform plaisn to forest, and even so, the earliest, lightest ships dont require forest (a cludge so you can always leave even the smallest island), and modern ships arent wooden.-lajzar 1.3 - Make fish appear on right place It would be nice if the Earth map had its fish ressources in the right place. I'm saying this because I remember it was quite something to make it on the "Marla's Earth map" for Civ3-Trifna 2 - Food 2.1 - Sharing -there should be some way to share food resources, there should be no reason to have two cities near each other, linked via road with one overflowing with food and the other starving. -Bleyn 2.2 - Food only tiles - "Rice" tiles : can't produce anything else than food, but lots of it, say five or six, and more with irrigation / railroad / farmland.-Spiffor 3 - Synthetics 3.1 - Resources produced in factories 3.1.1 - Strategic resources -Rubber should be able to be synthetically produced in certain factories after a certain date, say after the civilization discovers Synthetic Fossil Fuels... After that time rubber can be found on the map, grown, or produced in Rubber factories -DarkCloud 3.1.2 - Luxuries There should be a way to build manufactured luxuries (cars, hi-fi, but also some manufactured medieval ones). A specific improvement, say "car factory" should be available if you have the needed resources (coal, iron and oil), and would turn one shield into a luxury. It would also cease to function when you stop having these resources. You couldn't build more "luxury producing improvements" than the number of civs, and only one per city -Spiffor 3.1.3 - Other resources Dye and Saltpepper could also be synthetically produced with a factory or a chemical factory -Wernazuma III/DarkCloud 3.1.4 - Raw materials into resources Maybe you can turn raw materials into new resources, that can be traded. eg: You start near Barley. If you build a brewer, it can be turned into Beer, a luxury resource with +1 food. You could use it to supply your empire, or you could trade it off to another civ. -Mongoloid Cow 3.2 - Un-historical resource restrictions Unlogic and historical failures: 3 cases of recource restrictio... -
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Civ 4 the List: Regional & City Menus
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Created by:
Addled Platypus
Civ 4 the List: Regional & City Menus
Introduction A big part of playing Civ games has always been the city screen. This is traditionally where you set production for your cities. Where you check on a city's status, etc. What could we envision for Civ IV? Perhaps new features. New ways to make cities interact with the rest of the game. Perhaps divide the nation into regions, each with their own screen. Post your ideas here Summary A lot that is suggested here will be new to the game "and hopefully added". Help think of the ways these changes should look, what information is needed on the screen. If all possible, add screen shots. The term Region will represent the terms region and state in this thread Related Threads Game Atmosphere Recommend City Pollution Managers Table of Contents 1.0.0 Regional Menus 2.0.0 City Menus Conclusion The Ideas 1.0.0 Regional Menus 1.1.0 Copy/Paste Build Orders And Assign to Specific Cities/Regions 1.1 Have a big screen with everything a city is building and have the option to copy and paste build orders. This would work well for both city and region. 1.2.0 Assign Workers to Regions 1.2 Assign some of your workers to regions, if we still have the Civ3 worker system, and have the regional menu govern the workers (or public works). 1.3.0 Subdivide Empire into States 1.3 i am sure this has been addressed elsewhere, but it is relevant to this topic as well. i like the idea of being able to subdivide your empire in states (maybe as a product of a tech, like federalism). the state would be four or five cities, bound together (the sum total of their cultural influence would determine the border), with a designated capitol. the border would have to continuous. this state capitol help off-set corruption, and it allows you to bring up an in depth menu for the cities in that state. so rather micromanaging on 6 different city screen, you could micromanage all six cities (and indeed the state itself) from the state screen. Should there be a region wide unhappiness for loss of a city? Editable, change to/from a region? Limit number of Regions 1.4.0 More Options for Automated Build Queues 1.4 More options for automating build queues would be nice. They might not be important for games on small maps and/or for games on very high difficulty levels, but average level epic games (huge map) really suffer because of horrific amounts of micromanagement. The MOO3 system, allowing different priorities based on the role of a planet (a city or a region in CIV), works very well. Something along these lines exists in Civ3, but in order the empire to function properly, you'd have to set those priorities for each city individually and then change them as the game progresses and cities change their roles in your empire. So basically, though there seems to be a system implemented in Civ3, it still forces you to manage each city individually. That's a thing MOO3 is way ahead of Civ3 and something that could really improve epic games. Or, if a similar system can't be implemented in CIV (there could be trouble with it, I know that), at least do two things: 2.1 Add the possibility to have multiple build queues designed by the player. 2.2 Allow adding any buildings and units to such queues. If by the time the city tries to build them they are not allowed, just discard them and move to the next position in queue or ask the player what to do. The current system won't let you add a Cathedral after a Temple, so you are bound to have to set the production manually. And it's no fun once you have 40+ cities... 3. Be able to specify to your governors specific favorite construction projects and specific things to never build. 4. I'd also like to think about some levels of national management, which would introduce alot of simplicity. There is already a precedent for it in the Ministers, but I think maybe adding some ministers and expanding their role would really reduce micromanagement. For instance, the Minister of Labour could replace the current worker model with a national workforce of some sort to do tile improvements. I think this would be a better solution than regional workforces, because that's still alot of micromanagement. You could manage the entire national workforce as a whole from the Labour Ministry, if you had to really manage it at all. Tile improvements you could just do with a right click on the the tile you want to work, limited in some fashion by the manpower available in your workforce. 2.0.0 City Menus 2.1.0 Automation of Tile Usage 2.1 I would like to see some automation of tile usage placement. I think the easiest thing would be three sliders - growth,production,commerce. If you peg the production slider, it uses the tiles that will produce whatever is in your que in the shortest time. This includes knowing when to work a food tile so that the city will grow and... -
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Civ 4 the List: Movement & Supply
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Created by:
Trifna
Civ 4 the List: Movement & Supply
Introduction Movement and supply? How do troops move? How do railroads function, and do units lose hitpoints when they're beyond national borders? All this and more is addressed in this thread. Summary Railroad infinite movement was a major issue, occupying over 90 posts of arguments in the main thread between a mulititude of posters. Other issues were how to implement supply with borders and whether naval units should have variable movement rates due to oceanic weather. Table of Contents 1.0.0 Supply 2.0.0 Speed of Units 2.1.0 RR Infinite Movement 2.2.0 Different transport infrastructures 2.3.0 Naval Units 2.3.1 Speeds of Naval Units and Other Issues 2.3.13 Landing Troops from a Transport 2.4.0 Speed on Land (Roads, Railroads, etc.) 2.5.0 Air Units: Movement and Speed 2.6.0 Speed, All Units 2.7.0 Limiting Expansion and Ligtning-Speed Discovery 3.0.0 Tactical Movement (Flanking, Between Mountains, Etc.) 4.0.0 Coordinate System, Tiles, Movement System 5.0.0 Other Issues Conclusion The Ideas 1.0.0 Supply 1.1.1 Use C3’s movement and supply Use C3's movement and supply (or the lack thereof) system. It's simple and it works.-Kuciwalker 1.1.2 But- Supply solves issues supply rules can fix the to-easy-to-conquer problem while leaving RR at no movement cost.-Straybow 1.2.0 Cost of troops in foreign territory military equipment and troops stationed in enemy territory cost 1 extra gold! The cost of resupplying these troops!-Tiberius 1.3.0 Support : AI-driven support units or pillage There are basically two major groups in military (Iraq, Vietnam...): armed troops and support troops. Troops may also support themselves on the field, pillaging or else. But it is often better to support the troops. Without the player touching anything, some AI-directed support troops could relay between your territory and your troops in another territory. The player should place units to protect those from enemy interference. It would solve: War making more sense economically (pillage/support, cost) and tactically (difficulty of invading would make more sense, protecting could be useful...). Some factors could have an effect on the capacity to support or pillage: technology, money, terrain...-Trifna 1.4.0 One supply unit, nothing else To go over my earlier suggestion, "supply" would be a simple % bonus that radiates from a supply unit. Units are still effective without supply, but they are better with it. The supply unit is also the 1st defender, and the 1st receiver of artillery bombard. This causes the player to always try to keep his supply unit 2 tiles behind his main stack.-wrylachlan 1.5.0 Risks for ships in foreign waters Every turn a ship is outside your waters, there is a percentage chance it looses a hp. [...] You can use the exact same mechanism on land.-wrylachlan 1.6.0 A normal unit doing the supply, and lack of supplies’ effects Let's say we use CTP- combat stacks for Civ4... Ok, some special units might not need supply at all, but there could be a supply unit as mentioned a forehead or HQ in the army stack in which regular units disengaging from the stack could trace supply from. Or the army commander could just be that tracing HQ unit. You know... as a HQ unit in board games. The same should go with ships, but a flagship could be selected within the stack or they just use a supply ship. Such naval stacks should also work as a supply source for armies so that an expeditionary corps will have a supply source to trace from.-ThePlagueRat 1.7.0 Units without supply, what do we do with them? Many options... Reduced movement and/or attack efficiency, reinforcement (healing) in enemy territory reduced. Therefore you as a player would go into the field with a stack, and perhaps disengage units into the terrain when appropriate. Like we did in Ctp, without this supply system though. How to use stacks should be pretty much up to each player, IMO. Supply could even be reduced by the HQ (supply unit) not having a road/railroad going back home in adjacent square. Then friendly cities must work as HQ with a decent range of supply. That brings us to levels of supply: - Supply sources would here be friendly cities, a fleet or a HQ with a clean route to any of these:0: No supply sources in range, no route to a friendly city or other far away sources: (typically Stalingrad) Penalties would be highest.1: No supply sources in range, clean route to friendly city or source outside range: Typical one by one unit scattering. Would have quite high penalties on attack and reinforement and therefore only suitable for unit of certain types with special capabilities, like Guerillas and such.2: A supply sources (e.g. a HQ-sta... -
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Civ 4 the List: Government & Social Engineering
Introduction Government is not only the leader's primary tool, It's the supreme organization in every nation. Society is the human network of personal connections, and the norms that can hold a civilization together, or break it. This is the place for suggestions for the implementation of both of these in the game. Index 1. Government ( Government choices, new governments, change of existing government forms. ) 2. Society ( similar to SMAC's Social Engineering models) 3. Federalism vs. Centralization 4. SE Proposals and Government Models 5. Other (Misc) Conclusion The Ideas 1. Government ( Government choices, new governments, change of existing government forms. ) Bring back Fundamentalism, and several of the Civ3:Conquests governments.-Brent. New governments for the ancient age, like "City state", which would be similar to a republic, but more primitive, and "Empire", which would allow you to control large territories.-skywalker An assembly with a mind of it's own in democratic governments, that could make some decisions on it's own. (but not complicate the game too much)-Stefu The ability to fully customize the government, Describing the internal political system of it, and then, if needed, answering the government's democratic institutions, etc.-Cras The changes of government, should be mostly left for the society itself, and not for the player, while the player could have means dealing with such things, such as supressing it with police, or changing the government's priorities. If all fails, you'll be either be able to peacefully, and automatically, and peacefully switch to the government of the people's desire, or fall into anarchy. You'll also be able to try and push governmental change yourself, but that will have to have popular support, as well.-Lorizael Having government departments, instead of mini-wonders, to describe the functions of one's government. Those will also evolve, and appear over time, and technology.-Mr. Nice Guy A Libertarian government, that would have no conscription, little taxes, more pollution, but more efficiency, and more happiness.-Lawrence of Arabia The choices made by the government ( perhaps in the Social Engineering model - Az ) will be used to 'calculate' to what sort of government does a certain government belong.-Mr. Orange 2. Society ( similar to SMAC's Social Engineering models) A system of different factors as in SMAC where each factor is on part of governments: like "social values" (religion - science - nobility [goes from European nobles to Confucius] - individualistic freedom - nationalism), "statecraft" (from totalitarian to total demnocracy), "power structure (from centralized to tribal), "economics" (from communism to complete capitalism), "justification of power" and "justice system" (theocratic to complete far west).See this post for the complete model.-Trifna Traits having having a limited lifetime, and being changed either through gradual change, or revolution-Sandman Having scroll bars define various aspects of society: like market economy, nationalism, religion, etc.-Optimizer A system similar to SMAC, having the earth equivalents of the SMAC societal traits.-Fosse. A system that would having two major choices: One of economic systems: like capitalism, socialism, mercantilism, etc. and one of political structures, ala democracy, monarchy, totalitarian. etc. Also, smaller chocies would be available, like treatment of minorities, slavery, etc.-Stefu Societal interaction - factions and classes in the society that would interact. Their levels would depend on their numbers, their civ traits, and the civilization level.-The_Aussie_Lurker 3. Federalism vs. Centralization> Instead of courthouses, have county seats, that would have similar effects to the palace, only smaller, and would be one for every 5 cities. In those places, governors would be appointed, and general happiness level for the regions would exist. If the happiness will become too low, the region could rebel.-Trebuchet Governor Indpendence - governors choosing a percentage of the next items under construction, that percentage depending on the government.-lajzar 4. SE proposals, and government models Trifna's Social Egineering model: *system of valors*religion - science - nobility [goes from European nobles to Confucius] - individualistic freedom - nationalism *statecraft*totalitarian [includes king only or pope, depending on "power justification"] - oligarchic [includes king + nobles or whattever else] - moderate democracy [some have more power, like actual democracies] - total democracy *power structure*centralized - federation - republic - [Switzerland-like] - decentralized [includes anarchist local self-government, tribal local governance...] *economics*communism - soft-line communism [not following completely] - wealth s... -
Civ 4 the List: General Ideas
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Created by:
DarkCloud
Civ 4 the List: General Ideas
Introduction Here's the section for General Ideas, Ideas that either transcend all the other categories, or just don't quite fit under any of the other topics. Thanks for reading,-List Threadmaster DarkCloud Summary Well, the best way to read this section is to read the titles, as varied as they are because they’ll give you some idea of what you’re up against. The ideas are so varied that it’s hard to give a summary to this section. This is where everything that did not quite fit went to ‘fit’ itself. Related Threads Growth - Should it be Related to Food, frenzyfol Terrorism, grap 1705 Advisors and Magistrates, skycommando Get Rid of Building Every Improvement Everywhere, polypheus Index 1.0.0- Radical Ideas; Game Structure 2.0.0- Animation/Theming/Graphics 3.0.0- Automation/Programming 4.0.0- Characterization/Historical/Realistic 5.0.0- Maps/Display Conclusion The Ideas 1.0.0 Radical Ideas; Game Structure 1.1.0 Scenario/ Civ-Splitting/ Complete Reworking of Civ-Rules/Structure *From another thread, the first time you play Civ4, only a few large, major civs are available to start with, such as Chinese, Semites, Indoeuropeans. To keep from having the same exact group of civs for the whole game, there would be breakoffs. Indoeuropeans can split into Romans, Celts, Germans, Slavs, Indians, etc. The idea for winning the game would be to have the culture group created by you and your breakoffs control the world. On your next game, either the first generation of breakoffs or all breakoffs for that last game are available to start with. The civs you identify with would tend to be created because of the civs you previously chose. Ingame, give the player a message when a minor civ breaks off, asking if you want it to become a playable civ for future games. When this happens, give the player a readout of the civ's stats to edit if desired, or stats could be filled out later in the editor. *Traits chosen for your political party become standard traits for breakoff civs. Maybe combine and balance political traits with civ traits. *Semites can split into Hebrews, Egyptians, Hyksos, Berbers, Babylonians. Hebrews split into Israelites, Arabs, Midianites, Edomites. Judah can split off from Israel. Maybe Israel splits into a separate civ for each of Jacob's wives. Maybe Rachel and Leah start as one splitoff. Leah splits into Judah, Simeon, Reuben, etc. Judah splits into Zarah, Phares, and Shelah, or Sephards and Ashkenazi. Arabs split into Libyans, Saudis, Iraqis. *There can be confederacies, such as Switzerland, and the Philipines can be treated as one too. A confederacy is a group of minor tribes that start near each other. It is assumed that they will use diplomacy to merge eventually. The Philipines would only show up on a large Far East or random map. They could also have their own scenario. The Swiss could be a cohesive civ on any map or a confederacy on a large random map. They could have their own scenario or be part of a German scenario. *Using a similar system to GalCiv, have standard traits for each civ plus the player chooses extra traits for a political party or a specific leader, and these bonus traits could be lost with a change of politics. The player can set a number of points for all civs in the game. Macroculturegroups: Africa, Asia, America, Europe. Africa: East, North, West, Central. Asia: Arab, Mesopotamia, Central, Far East, Caucasus, Southeast, India, Himilayas, Palestine. America: Eastern Woodlands, Great Plains, Southwest, California, Mesoamerica, South America Europe: Iberia, German, Celtic, British Isles, Scandinavia, Slavic, Italic, Balkan, Alps. Independant medium- level culture groups: Pacific, Arctic, Siberia (with overlap). Currently I say anywhere from 8 to 64 Major civs and about 200 minors. I don't care if the civs I like have uniqueness, but I want most of them to have plenty of city names. (Ed: This idea would work as a special scenario for civ and would really change the game mechanics. Personally, I don't think it would add much, but it would certainly inject a more arcade-feel into the game and be something completely new!)-Brent In pregame setup, be able to specify that each culture group start on its own landmass, or group them by hemisphere. Maybe be able to give each civ its own landmass. Be more precise with culturally linked starting locations. Maybe have an optional small cookie cutter starting region for each civ that could be inserted into random maps, but on large maps make sure most of thje map is random and disallow cookie cutter starting regions on small maps.-Brent 1.2.0 Weather I think it would be kewl to add climate values to terrain types and setting a probability to that tile that weather behaves a certain way during an action and possibly during a non-action. Havin... -
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Civ 4 the List: Diplomacy
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Created by:
TechWins
Civ 4 the List: Diplomacy
Introduction I don't have much time to discuss this in detail, but I feel that there should be more to diplomacy than in previous Civ games. In Civ3 right now you are basically either at peace or at war. Granted there is 'feelings' towards each Civ, but they simply don't play a big enough role. I believe that there should be levels of engagement, such as cease-fire, allied peace, neutral, etc.. I'll go into detail later on.-TechWins I couldn't agree with this more. There definitely needs to be something beyond merely "allied" for instance. Historically, allies could change sides pretty easily (hello, Italy!), but there needs to be something the signifies a deep and resounding friendship and trust between two Civs. For instance, American and Britain wouldn't go to war together, not even if Britain could take on America. Why? The Americans and Britains are friends and allies, and largely see many basic things the same. Something like this would make it so that you can have some allies you are certain of, and othes you are wary of. I think it would be fair to penalize players that break such alliances with the universal loathing and mistrust of all other Civs, though you should be able to back out of it bit by bit. I am sure you can see many other levels of interest there could be.-Drachasor Summary Unit trading is a must, as the below illustrates. Civvers really want a lot more in terms of diplomacy options. They want to be able to coordinate with allies, and to trade territory itself. Also, they want computer players to consider massing armies near their borders to be a sign of agression. Related Threads Diplomacy (CyberShy aka Robert Plomp) Occupied Territories (skycommando) Index 1.0.0 International Diplomacy 2.0.0 Land Control 3.0.0 Treaty Rules 4.0.0 Graphics/Mechanics of Diplomatic Negotiations 5.0.0 Diplomatic Options 6.0.0 Terrorism 7.0.0 General Diplomacy Conclusion The Ideas 1.0.0 International Diplomacy 1.1.0 International Peace Conference Since the world wars are difficult, if not impossible, to end, there should be a possibility to call international congresses (by clicking a button in the diplomacy / shift-D screen). (See this site for how it should look: ) The central proposition (such as "peace treaty with any other, right of passage with any other"...) must be accepted by all so that the congress is a success. The proposition would make the leaders react, and you can see with their faces if they agree or not. If they don't agree, what to do Bribe them! By double clicking on their face, a specialized diplomacy screen should pop up, where you make propositions only to make them accept the treaty (private diplomacy can be held anywhere else during the game). Naturally, you don't want to pay for the whole world peace. In such a situation, there should be a button when you're speaking to "give to..." an other : (See this site) Once you click it, the concessions you ask from your partner don't go to you, they go to another civ. Here's an example: Let's say the Aztecs have won against the Iroquois, capturing Salamanca, but due to intricated MPPs, this war cannot cease. As the neighbours of the peaceful Iroquois, you don't want the balance to be broken by an unfinishable war. Then, you call a congress between Iroquois, Aztecs, all of their allies. The Aztecs will accept the peace treaty for 20 gold per turn, but you feel the Iroquois must pay: On the congress screen you double click on Hiawatha, choose "give to..." -> "the Aztecs". And then, as you would do in a normal diplomacy screen "gold"-> "per turn" -> "20". (See this site: ) When you return on the congress screen, you see Moctezuma accepting, because he knows he recieves a compensation. If you definately cannot have everyone accept, you could kick the "rebels" out the congress.Well, I admit managing the other's diplomacy is not easy, so I think such a tool should be completely optional.But useful if you want to influence more directly the others. These multilateral bargainings could be used to make solid alliances too, by asking all those who are MPPed with you to MPP between themselves as well. (or to ask everyone to reduce his nuclear weapons, and so on...) International congresses should be available once nationalism is discovered, or once UN is built. I don't think the AI could manage such a thing, so only the player could call for one. If the negociations succeed, due to your great diplomatic skill, the invited civs would be a bit more likely to vote for you.-Spiffor 1.2.0 Sanctions, Etc. Declare atrocities, sanctions, nuclear arms reductions, pollution reductions-David Murray 1.3.0 Spies Know Intended International Council Votes Your spies should know the vote intentions of infiltrated civs (POSSIBLE SPY OPTION??? INFILTRATE PLANNED COUNCIL VOTE... -
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Civ 4 the List: Civilizations 2
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Created by:
Civ 4 the List: Civilizations 2
Index 1.0.0 Types of Civs 2.0.0 Rulers 3.0.0 Colonies 4.0.0 Immigration 5.0.0 Nations' Compositions 6.0.0 Proposed Civ Lists 7.0.0 Civ Traits 8.0.0 Civ Placement 9.0.0 Unique Units 10.0.0 Other Conclusion 3.0.0 Colonies 3.0.1 Colonies As Air Bases *Colonies should be counted as air bases. You own them, they're outside of your territory and they are semi cities...so why can't you land planes there?-Jer8m8 3.0.2 Combatting ICS With Colonies *If the colonies, for example, contribuited toward corruption costs but couldn't grow beyond certain sizes or produce certain items, and yet proved useful to the player in harvesting resources in certain areas, then they would fit a nice civ-game niche.-DarkCloud -You can only build it on top of a resource. However, you can build one on the coast as long as it's on an island, across a sea, ocean, etc, and connected to a resource (with a colony on it). -You can only build one colony per resource tile, and you must declare which resource it is connected to (any of them not already claimed by another colony). -You can only station (and build) smaller boats there (galleys, privateers, caravels, galleons, transports, destroyers). -You can station up to two air units there, but only if you have an airstrip (same functions as an airport). -You can station as many ground units as you want until you hit tanks (you can only station 5 or so). -You can build a barracks, so that you don't have to transport back obsolete units to upgrade them. -A colony only has influence on the square that it is located on. -Colonies act as population 1, and may fall into civil disorder (which may eventually force the disbading of the colony). There is always a specialist, however, and it may be any of the normal kind (so as to make it specialized in some sort of way). -A colony will disband if captured or if someone elses boundaries encircle it.-Bob Rulz 4.0.0 Immigration *Immigration/ Emigration.I once sent a post on another pre-CIV3 forum somewhere where I wanted this issue debated. CIV3 already has parts of it: if you conquer an enemy city, e.g the Greeks its inhabitants will still be greek for some while, happy or not. Now what would happen if the greeks could actually send people into your cities as workers whenever you're not at war, for example if your city is close to the greek borders. What if any civilization could do that? The city status window could show a diagram of the city population demographics, saying "90% Romans, 5% Greek, 2% Babylonians" or so. Those cities with more than, say, 20% foreign inhabitants could likely fall into disorder when a war erputs, or anytime on higher difficulty levels... restrictive/repressive governments (Communism? Despotism?) might throw out "unwanted" foreigners, thus decreasing city sizes... of course, YOU (the player) could send your own people to foreign cities... they would leave anyway if they don't like the way you govern the country, adding up to your competitor's city sizes... spies could only plant propaganda in cities holding inhabitants of your civilization (they can barely hide with people which language they don't speak or so)...-Cozy_22303 *Migration between cities of the same Civ-Brent *Allow some sort of ethnic purging, or allow some ability to expel ethnic groups from your civ if they grow too rowdy.-Shogun Gunner 5.0.0 Nation's Compositions 5.1.0 Minorities *You should be able to set up specific policies concerning how you treat your minority populations - do you tolerate them, promote a multicultural society, try to assimilate them or persecute them? *Perhaps you should only be able to set policies about minority groups comprising 20% of any individual city's population or 5% of your civilization's population, just so that this system does not become too unweildly.-Stefu 5.2.0 Dual-Heritage *As for citizens, they should be able to have at least a dual heritage that affects the relative levels of happiness and corruption in the cities you conquer... and also, this could introduce problems of immigration- for example: if too many Assyrians come into Babylonian cities- then perhaps the city will 'culture flop' into Assyrian when the next war occurs. *I would also like to see nationality levels for all citizens.-Drachasor/DarkCloud 5.3.0 Ethnic Heritage *I think that generally every conquered civilization should maintain its ethnic heritage. There should be some way to deal with the various ethnic values/wants/disagreements when managing your civilization. Therefore, if you want to conquer the world you'll have to find some way to appease those you are conquering, otherwise they might revolt and refound their civilization (perhaps this would allow you to exceed the max number of civs in the game). This would make it so that as you take over more groups it beco... -
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Civ 4 the List: Civilizations
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Civ 4 the List: Civilizations
Introduction Here's the section for Civilizations, dealing with all the data about how Tribes, Civilizations, Special Rulers and Special Bonuses and options for civilizations. Thanks for reading,-List Administrator DarkCloud Summary Basically, most of the discussion centered around civ-customizability, civil war nation-splitting and, minor civs. There was a large debate on the merits of the inclusion of Israel as a major civilization with some people citing Israel's contributions to civilization and linking it with the ancient Judea of the past, and some people arguing that since Israel has not been around very long contiguously that it is different from Judea, and cannot stand as an empire of its own. However trivial that debate seems, it did open discussion about what constitutes a Major Tribe (a Civilization). Some suggested that only "Imperial" empires could be considered Civilizations. Others suggested that a Civilization was only game worthy if it had "expanded and controlled an extended area of land and exerted its culture and influence upon disparate groups." Nowadays, of course, with today's faster communication and globalization, communications are affected faster and culture is spread over a more varied region, therefore this debate is close to becoming moot- however, personally, I support this definition of a Civilization. Nevertheless, as you will read below and in the conclusion, there were several suggestion to the relative proliferations of civilizations, ranging from people's suggestions of a "Create-A-Civ" Machine, to Extensive Minor Tribes, to "Dynamic Civilizations" as well as tangentially related suggestions such as Civil-War Empire splitting. Related Threads {The List} Civilization traits, Nuclear Master {The List}Civilizations, civilleader {The List}Civilizations, DarkCloud {The List}Civilizations Version II , DarkCloud Barbarians become civilized? , Mojotronica Civilization specific golden ages, Tripledoc {The List} Nomads and Chiefdoms, Spiffor Civ IV fit for minors, Fosse Barbarians, Master Zen Civil Wars, Metaliturtle Index 1.0.0 Types of Civs 2.0.0 Rulers 3.0.0 Colonies 4.0.0 Immigration 5.0.0 Nations' Compositions 6.0.0 Proposed Civ Lists 7.0.0 Civ Traits 8.0.0 Civ Placement 9.0.0 Unique Units 10.0.0 Other Conclusion The Ideas ----1.0.0 Types of Civs---- 1.1.0 Barbarian Civs *Barbarians, through capturing cities, could become civilizations themselves, over time. Thus we start with 8-10 civs on the map at the beginning and can end with 16 simultaneous civilizations.-narmox *Barbarians should be able to capture cities like they did in Civ II and start churning out their own units.-Rasputin *Barbarians should be able to trade-Azazel *Barbarians can be hired as mercenaries (Perhaps without a nationality [Like Privateers])*Barbarians can rent/loan/sell units*And if they are mercs there should be a chance (perhaps modified by your cultural strength and/or how much you paid for them (minimum, moderate, or high)or somethn) that they go independent or even turn against you since they are mercs after all (such as what german mercs did to the Romans occasionally)-Kramerman *If Barbarian civs don't generate Culture, then perhaps they could gain special Generals (Like Attila the Hun) or a "golden age" which will give them some culture. If they then conquer enough cities they can become a powerful military civ. Then again, if their golden age ends, or the leader dies this empire will likely fall apart.-ixnay *Instead of giving the Barbarians no culture, don't give them any Civ Attributes... Therefore they'd be weeded out through normal attrition after a short time*And if that wasn't enough of a handicap and barbs started overrunning actual Civ's you could give them a slight production handicap.-wrylachlan *New civs (like nomadic barbarians with strong armies) should appear at times to destroy weak civs because not only the Mongols, but a great variety of civs came out of nowhere. Those civs could be allowed to receive techs when conquering cities, so they can soon cope with their foes and not continue to live in the Stone Age...-Wernazuma III *I think that Barbarian 'civs' entering the industrial age should be given status as a regular civilization.-Panzeh *What if the barbs had their own research pool, a small number added to it each turn per settlement on the map. When the number adds up to a certain amount (average approx every 40 or 50 turns) one barbarian settlement somewhere in the world (determined at random) becomes a full-fledged Civ (using one of the unused Civs -- if all are used, it doesn't happen.) (Thanks to player's use of Barbarian settlements as Worker farms using Conquest's enslavement rules, this would be much more likely to occur.) Then the barb research pool drops back ... -
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Civ 4 the List: Cheats
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MattH
Civ 4 the List: Cheats
Introduction When I was young(er) I loved the CIV II cheat menu- got a pesky civ? Drop some tanks and stealth bombers on them. Need more movement? Add it in. Out of cash? Not anymore! Cheats were totally taken out of vanilla CIV III. Should they make a comeback in cIV? How should they manifest? Thanks for reading, -MattH Summary To Cheat or not to Cheat? Consensus:Cheats are needed as scenario editing tools. Disputed: Cheats are needed to balance multiplayer games. 1.0.0 The Function of Cheats 2.0.0 List of Proposed Cheats 3.0.0 Appearance of the Cheat Menus Conclusion The Ideas 1.0.0 The Function of Cheats: Perspective 1: Strict View Brent and others suggest that cheating should be implemented in the CIV II style, full cheats but with no hall-of-fame entry so that "It doesn't hurt anyone". Perspective 2: Limited Scope Perspective 2.1 No cheats whatsoever! They are a temptation and only serve to ruin the game. Perspective 2.2 Alva:No cheats, but include debug mode. Perspective 3: All-Encompasing Add functionality- Reveal and hide fog of war, make permant build changes to the AI, change unit paths, mess with the AI's understanding of the current map. Tassadar says transform cheat mode into a full-blown, in-game scenario editor. Perspective 4: Multiplayer Perspective 4.1 There is no reason to include MP cheats. Perspective 4.2 A successful implementation would allow players to compensate for poor starting locations, a lack of reasources, and other disadvantages. Requests: Kucinich: Fix CIV II style cheat bugs. Sore Loser et. all: Add an Ironman mode similar to the one in SMAC where you're not "allowed" to reload. Majority Opinion: Cheats are a core part of the scenario editing process. Do not use "approved saves" (only allowed x turns) or similar save game restrictions to prevent reloading or to allow hall-of-fame points. 2.0.0 List of Proposed Cheats: - Enable / Disable - Switch between game / cheat mode (see Appearance of the Cheat Menu below) - Open / Close / Save scen. - Place: --- Start loc. --- Terrain --- City --- Unit --- Improvement --- Goody Hut --- Barbarian camp --- Resource / etc. --- Location based trigger - Edit: --- Start gold --- Current gold --- Start year --- Current year --- Attitude --- Status of relation (war, fixed alliances, etc.) --- Current trades --- Triggers / Scripts --- Object positions (units, cities, overlays, etc.) 3.0.0 Appearance of the Cheat Menu: Since the majority of contributors suggest that cheats be used primarily for scenario editing, I propose that what was the "cheat menu" in previous games become an in-game editor with a layout similar to the editor in Age of Empires or RON: the menu structure is transformed into in palette containing drag-and-drop units, terrain, etc. This or its appropriate translation (to make it fit into whatever cIV user interface) would be far superior than drop down menus or consoles featured in prevous Civ/other games. Conclusion The majority of posters desired cheats, though there was some controversy over Ironman mode as some declared it pointless in a Civ-style game. Others wanted cheats allowed, but to make certain that those games couldn't accidentally be saved to hall of fames, so that their halls of fame wouldn't be messed up by ugly "YOU CHEATED" signs. -Conclusion By: DarkCloud -Respecfully Compiled: MattH... -
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Civ 4 the List: The AI
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Civ 4 the List: The AI
Introduction The AI. What often makes a computer game playable, if it's made properly. This is the place to read for finding ideas relating to this concept. -List Threadmaster Nikolai Summary All in all, the thing people are most interested in, is a more "intelligent" AI. An AI that can defend itself, attack in a smart way, recognize a good deal when it sees it etc. People clearly think the AI isn't nearly as good as it should be. Index 1 - AI Madness 2 - Automation 3 - Treatment of Civs 4 - AI Performance 5 - Treatment of military matters 6 - Diplomacy 7 - Modability Conclusion The Ideas 1 - AI Madness 1.1 Aggressiveness Currently, the game is too prone to AI madness.For example, one AI will suggest- "EVERYONE DECLARE WAR ON PLAYER!” and the others will automatically agree. Or perhaps the player will utilize this exploit, as is shown in this example and screw the other computer players: "Everyone please declare war on Russia. Remember, Russia is going to nuke all of your cities since you’re a lot closer to it than I am" - Player. Instead, the computer should see this and realize it and decide- "Uh, no. How about we declare war on you instead? - AI" (Posted By Comrade Tassadar; Heavily Edited by DarkCloud) 1.2 - No unit movement without a reason One thing: the AI should NOT move its units all over the place for no reason. It's really completely silly to see the AI constantly move its stuff for no reason... (ed (darkcloud): and in addition to wasting player time; it’s bad coding left over from Civ II. Can’t the AI make a decision and stick with it- thereby completing a task? The GOTO commands do seem to work quite well in this regard. Instead of being scrapped completely, this should be heavily revamped because if the AI doesn’t have a plan for each unit- then it would become much easier for the player to win while also making for a more tedious game.) (Posted by Trifna) 2 - Automation 2.1 - Units and cities I want to be able to automate settlers to build cities in good spots without worrying about them, but I don't want those cities to automatically go on governor like in SMAC. I want automated land units and transports to work together, if they don't already. (Posted By Brent) 3 - Treatment of civs 3.1 - Treat all civs alike I really hope they make the AI stop treating the player differently from the other civs. It's the only thing that really bothered me in Civ3. It can't be that hard to code a proper AI, hire better programmers if you can't do it They did it in Galactic Civilizations (granted, it's a different game). For me it really breaks the mood of the game when you notice that the AI-civs gradually start giving you crappier deals even if it would hurt them more. And for no apparent reason. Theoretically, in the deity level, it shouldn't be too hard to code the AI to make "best possible" moves and give them a long term plan according to their civilization characteristics. (Posted By KorvaKikkeli) 3.2 - Small civs vs big civs Fear and domination. I find it wierd when a 2 city Civ right at my doorstep refuses my demands. The AI should be adjusted so that these weak Civs can be "controlled" and manipulated by larger one's without losing their independence. (Posted by Strider_479) 4 - AI performance 4.1 - Overall AI performance The AI should be able to handle every concept of the game with a decent skill (Posted By TheBirdMan) Make it better! (Posted by skywalker) 4.2 - Adaptive AI One idea I have seen being suggested is altering the AI's priorities, based on your actions. For example; if start researching tech x each time you start and get it first because the AI never really was interested in it, it would change it's behaviour to start 'copying' your style and try to beat you at your own game. Therefore ruining your playing style and forcing you to change your game. (this will probably be more effective on higher levels then on, say chieftan but it a start)(Posted by alva) 4.3 - Harder on higher levels On a Diety, or whatever they decide to call the highest level, the AI should be able to beat me, the worst Civ player ever. (Posted by POTUS) 4.4 - AI recognizing reasons to events Give the AI the ability to recognize if events leading to deals with them getting canceled were out of your control or deliberately player-caused. I'm tired of trading with one computer civ only to have some crazy war break out somewhere that disrupts my trade route with them. After this no other civs will trade with me; they're all "RAR WE REMEMBER WHAT YOU DID TO FRANCE WE'RE NOT DUMB SO WE'LL NEVER TRADE WITH YOU"(Posted by ixnay) 4.5 - Multi-threaded AI Perhaps that to consider a multi-threaded AI like in GalCiv would be a good idea. In the case of GalCiv, it permits an overall better AI. (Pos... -
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