MLB - 2010 Spring Training!

[Imran Siddiqui]

I don't consider it absurd to imagine that he won't be voted in.

Considering that Bert Blyleven probably won't make it, I'm not surprised by any player failing to make the cut.

[snoopy369]

Perhaps that should read, "I don't consider it entirely unreasonable", then.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Then maybe I can say, "I consider it to be slightly unreasonable, but then I'm used to lack of reason by the Hall of Fame voters"

[Ben Kenobi]

I think he's about an even chance to have used and/or not used.]

What do you base this opinion on? All the lists I've seen have put Delgado firmly in the 'non-user' category.

[Flatlander Fox]

False. He played average defense. His range factor is around the average RF.

He did win 5 Gold Gloves, so a few of his contemporaries seem to disagree with you.

Snoopy brings up a great point: Delgado was never perceived as the best player at his position even during his peak years. His dearth of All Star appearances will be the final nail in his HOF coffin, you can't put a guy in who was not considered to be one of the best when he was playing.

[Imran Siddiqui]

He did win 5 Gold Gloves, so a few of his contemporaries seem to disagree with you.

@ using Gold Gloves as evidence of good defense. Derek Jeter has a few Gold Gloves too, and has been a horrific defensive SS (there was hope he had turned it around in 2004, but he's gone back down since).

Gwynn's career Fielding Runs Above Average/year is 0.3. If you are curious, Jeter's is -8.0 and Delgado is -3.0 (though that includes his OF stints).

Snoopy brings up a great point: Delgado was never perceived as the best player at his position even during his peak years. His dearth of All Star appearances will be the final nail in his HOF coffin, you can't put a guy in who was not considered to be one of the best when he was playing.

Um... of course you can. Especially considering how wrong the All Star voters are every year (and people argue about snubs all the time). I mean if we kept players out based on "not being percieved as the best player at his position", Duke Snider would never get to sniffing point of the Hall (Hell, the guy played during the era of Willie Mays and Mickey Mantle). Sometimes you have a glut of great players at one position. And sometimes great players are neglected either because of where they play or because they aren't showy enough.

I mean, Hell, Delgado wasn't sent to the All Star game in a year where he finished 6th in the MVP voting (2005).

[-Jrabbit]

There are always All Star anomalies. Some players have a great first half, then fade or get injured. Others get hot for the 2nd half and get MVP votes.

[Imran Siddiqui]

So using All Star appearances (or lack thereof) to deny entry into the HoF is very, very flawed.

[Ming]

Using All Star appearances to measure anything beyond how popular a player is is just silly. Between the fans voting for guys who are injured and haven't played much to homers stuffing the ballot box, all you have is a popularity contest, not a true judge of skill or performance. The whole game is a joke. The fact that the outcome can actually impact the World Series is even dumber. To have the home team selected based on the game is just soooooooooo wrong.

[Flatlander Fox]

I mean if we kept players out based on "not being percieved as the best player at his position", Duke Snider would never get to sniffing point of the Hall (Hell, the guy played during the era of Willie Mays and Mickey Mantle).

After Mays and Mantle, who was perceived to be better than Snider?

Is Delgado head and shoulders above his contemporaries: Thome, Raffy, McGwire, Helton, Bagwell, Grace, Ortiz or Pujols? The OF list is even longer.

I'm not saying he wasn't a very good to great player. He just doesn't pass the "First Sight" test for me.

[Imran Siddiqui]

So, what, now we have being considered 3rd best is enough to be "percieved as the best player at his position"? Not saying that such an entirely subjective measure isn't bull**** in the first place, but it is quite obvious that Snider was a distant 3rd.

And did you just seriously put Mark Grace in the mix with all those 1B? Really? Speaking of Palmeiro though, he only has 4 All Star appearances under his belt, though the steroids may doom him.

[-Jrabbit]

Yeah, the Grace thing was funny. Re Palmiero --

though the steroids may doom him.

"May"????

[Imran Siddiqui]

Comeback Players of the Year:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/baseball/mlb/10/05/carpenter.hill.ap/index.html

Chris Carpenter and Aaron Hill.

[Imran Siddiqui]

"May"????

Well, the Veteran's Committee still exists, and who knows how they are percieved in 15+ years or so.

[-Jrabbit]

Everyone knows those selected by the Vet Committee aren't "real " HOFers anyway.