"Kansas has found the ultimate way to punish the poor"

[Ben Kenobi]

To me that is pre judging a black person that has yet to do you wrong

This is intro psychology. We'd expect someone exposed to aversive stimuli to react differently when exposed to similar stimuli after the exposure than before.

keep trying to change what you said to make it not seem so racist.

To me the ratio of black on white crime vs white on black is shocking. We're taught the exact opposite in school.

[rah]

Doesn't change anything.
Your statement

If black people robbed you, I'd not consider it prejudice for you to be angry at black people in general

is racist by definition not matter how much you try to reword it in a more acceptable fashion. (clue, it's not possible)

Just say it is and that you're wrong and I'll remove it from my sig. If not, the post and accusation stand.

[Ben Kenobi]

Just say it is and that you're wrong and I'll remove it from my sig. If not, the post and accusation stand.

It's a free country, rah. How many people who have me on ignore give me free advertising like you do?

[rah]

Yes, you are correct, you are free to be a bigot and I'm free to advertise it. You have to love America.

[Ben Kenobi]

Yes, you are correct, you are free to be a bigot and I'm free to advertise it. You have to love America.

I'm personally amused that you think I'd be bothered with the free advertising. Don't you do this sort of thing for a living?

[rah]

No I don't. As always, you just made it up just like everything else. That would be my brother.

And yeah, if you bring it up, I think it does bother you.
I would think it would bother anyone that pretends to be a Christian.

[Berzerker]

Sava should be in jail because he broke the law.

But you defended the law by pointing at someone who stole from you, sava wasn't the thief

So you don't believe theft is a crime? The OT says 7 times what is stolen should be recompensated.

Then the OT doesn't say you should be jailed for stealing... And you cited Jesus, not the OT.

"Christ's love is in correction of sins. Steal from someone, go to jail. Simple to me."

Where did Jesus say you should be jailed for theft? Where did Jesus say I should be jailed because someone else stole from you?

Being black is a criminal offense now? And people call me racist? I think black people would be offended being compared to dopeheads.

I cant speak for what offends black people, but they and "dopeheads" have been punished based on collective guilt and you're advocating the punishment of people based on collective guilt. A Canadian stole property, should Canadians be jailed too?

Dealers should go to jail because they are breaking the law.

The Romans executed Christians for breaking the law

[Ben Kenobi]

No I don't. As always, you just made it up just like everything else. That would be my brother.

Ah. Well, honest mistake there.

And yeah, if you bring it up, I think it does bother you.

Hrm? You just brought it up. And then asked me to repudiate it so you would take it down. I've said nothing about it previously. Like I said, it's a free country.

That whole repudiation thing assumes I must hate it.

I would think it would bother anyone that pretends to be a Christian.

Given your support for gay marriage, etc. I don't much care what you believe constitutes Christianity.

[Ben Kenobi]

But you defended the law by pointing at someone who stole from you, sava wasn't the thief

"Should sava be in jail?"

"Yes"

"What for?"

"Distribution and cultivation of a controlled substance."

Question asked, question answered.

Then the OT doesn't say you should be jailed for stealing... And you cited Jesus, not the OT.

Theft is a crime, Berz.

I cant speak for what offends black people,

Tell them that you believe smoking dope is equivalent to being black then. See what they tell you. Report back.

The Romans executed Christians for breaking the law

You've stated that you'd support confiscation of Church property. How do you reconcile that with what you've stated here?

[Berzerker]

"Should sava be in jail?"

"Yes"

"What for?"

"Distribution and cultivation of a controlled substance."

Question asked, question answered.

Your "justification" for jailing sava was a "dopehead" stole from you... Instead of telling us thieves should be jailed you decided "dopeheads" should be jailed because one stole from you.

Theft is a crime, Berz.

And you belong to an organization that has amassed a fortune by stealing, but where did Jesus say thieves should be jailed?

Tell them that you believe smoking dope is equivalent to being black then. See what they tell you. Report back.

I didn't say they were equivalent, I asked if you also want to punish black people if a black person steals from you. A Canadian stole from you, should Canadians be jailed? And it sounds like you already "equate" black people with dopeheads, "If black people robbed you, I'd not consider it prejudice for you to be angry at black people in general" - Ben Kenobi

So you think black people should be judged collectively too. How about white people, Ben? The Canadian who stole from you was white I presume, are you okay with being angry at white people because one stole from you? Are you angry at white people?

You've stated that you'd support confiscation of Church property. How do you reconcile that with what you've stated here?

I said the Church has been stealing from people for centuries and you complained about governments seizing Church property and I repeated myself - I did not express support for either, just stating a fact you're intent on ignoring... btw, laws are made by governments so I imagine seizing Church property was legal and it was illegal for the Church to keep that property - so why do you ignore "the law" now? I never said I supported anything nor do I see any need for reconciliation. You have argued sava should be jailed for breaking the law because its the law, Romans executed Christians for breaking the law. You are the one lacking clarity.

[Ben Kenobi]

Your "justification" for jailing sava

My justification for why Sava should be arrested is because he distributes and cultivates a controlled substance. I just answered this question.

Also, theft is still a crime Berz.

I didn't say they were equivalent,

You just did. You argued that people can discriminate against Dopeheads just like some people discriminate against black folks. I suggest you ask them what they think of your analogy.

So you think black people should be judged collectively too.

All I stated is that I believe such a reaction to be a rational one. I did not say that I believed that I would do that myself. Just because a response is rational doesn't mean that it's what I would choose.

How about white people, Ben? The Canadian who stole from you was white I presume, are you okay with being angry at white people because one stole from you?

Yes, in fact I'm very angry over what the fellow did to my family. I have learned not to trust dopeheads.

Are you angry at white people?

I'm angry at dopeheads who have stolen from me at least 5 times. Different dopeheads too.

Once is a coincidence. 4, 5 times? That's a pattern.

I said the Church has been stealing from people for centuries and you complained about governments seizing Church property and I repeated myself

Ok, so you think that confiscating Church property is justice for what you believe they've done in the past?

[Berzerker]

My justification for why Sava should be arrested is because he distributes and cultivates a controlled substance. I just answered this question.

That isn't a justification, thats a law... Your "justification" for the law is a dopehead stole from you, therefore sava should be jailed.

Here was his question:

Do you think Sava belongs in prison because a drug user stole something from you?

And you said yes

I think Sava should be in jail for pushing dope, yes.

Your "justification" for jailing Sava is a drug user stole from you

You just did. You argued that people can discriminate against Dopeheads just like some people discriminate against black folks. I suggest you ask them what they think of your analogy.

You're the one arguing for discrimination against both black people and "dopeheads". And I'd ask a black person about the analogy if they wanted to jail millions of people because a "dopehead" stole from them, if they're such big fans of collective guilt then I'd like to see how they feel about being mistreated based on what someone else did.

All I stated is that I believe such a reaction to be a rational one. I did not say that I believed that I would do that myself. Just because a response is rational doesn't mean that it's what I would choose.

So its rational to mistreat black people?

Yes, in fact I'm very angry over what the fellow did to my family. I have learned not to trust dopeheads.

There ya go, collective guilt... So what do black people and dopeheads have in common? You think its rational to hate both.

Ok, so you think that confiscating Church property is justice for what you believe they've done in the past?

Justice would be returning the stolen loot to its owners, thats neither your Church or those governments. You belong to a vast criminal enterprise and you're complaining about dopeheads?

[Ben Kenobi]

That isn't a justification, thats a law

I believe laws should be followed. Do you?

Do you think Sava belongs in prison

Yes, I do and I explained why I believed that. Distribution and cultivation of a controlled substance.

You're the one arguing for discrimination against both black people and "dopeheads".

You're the one saying that dopeheads are just like black people. I don't think black people are necessarily dope users. Were dope users enslaved?

if they're such big fans of collective guilt then I'd like to see how they feel about being mistreated based on what someone else did.

I really doubt you'd make that comparison to a black person.

So its rational to mistreat black people?

Is it rational to be angry at them and to be more cautious after being mugged? Absolutely. I'm not quite sure why what one feels has to do with one's actions. Most people are able to separate the two, but I can see why you might not be able to.

There ya go, collective guilt... So what do black people and dopeheads have in common? You think its rational to hate both.

I said it's rational to be angry with black people in general if one is mugged by a black person. I've also said that it's rational to be angry with dope users when they choose to steal from you.

I notice no commentary on my statement with dope users, as I have had 5 steal from me. Are you defending their behavior as a fellow dope user?

Justice would be returning the stolen loot to its owners, thats neither your Church or those governments.

Ah. So confiscation is ok when it's 'justice'. So then I infer it would be just to seek confiscation from dopeheads who stole from me.

[rah]

Ben the "rational" racist. How can you call yourself a Christian? You have no problem telling me that I can't be a Christian while you act the worst one ever.

But it is funny to see you trying to back away from your statement by saying it's a rational feeling 'that you've never had'. Hilarious.

[Berzerker]

I believe laws should be followed. Do you?

Laws should be justified before they are followed... Would you turn in your neighbors for helping runaway slaves under the Fugitive Slave Act? Would you inform the Roman authorities about Christians?

Yes, I do and I explained why I believed that. Distribution and cultivation of a controlled substance.

You were asked if sava should be jailed for drugs because a dopehead stole from you, your answer was yes. All you did was cite the law as if it justifies itself.

You're the one saying that dopeheads are just like black people. I don't think black people are necessarily dope users. Were dope users enslaved?

I didn't say that, I said both have been and are the victims of collective guilt - which you endorse.

I really doubt you'd make that comparison to a black person.

Why not? I've made the exact same argument for white people, but you wont answer. Should people hate you because a white person stole from them?

Is it rational to be angry at them and to be more cautious after being mugged? Absolutely. I'm not quite sure why what one feels has to do with one's actions. Most people are able to separate the two, but I can see why you might not be able to.

Is it rational to be angry at black people because you were mugged? You seem to think so, you feel the same way about dopeheads.

I said it's rational to be angry with black people in general if one is mugged by a black person. I've also said that it's rational to be angry with dope users when they choose to steal from you.

Yes you did, but you want dope users tossed in jail for somebody else's theft. So why aren't you angry at white people, or Canadians...?

I notice no commentary on my statement with dope users, as I have had 5 steal from me. Are you defending their behavior as a fellow dope user?

I'm defending drug users, not thieves. Defending thieves is what you do, hell, you even joined them.

Ah. So confiscation is ok when it's 'justice'. So then I infer it would be just to seek confiscation from dopeheads who stole from me.

Of course, if someone steals from you justice requires the property be returned.