Pro-Life Means Protect the Earth

[MOBIUS]

Well, you've already seen the solution to your problem - convert to Islam and have more than one woman!

[HalfLotus]

[Heraclitus]

Now a bit unfair to ask you the same question, (a bit like kindergarten), though, I consider it fair to ask how many people you (as a christian) think the world can give a lifestyle at least as it is in the current western world ? The goal is of course that all people reaches this.

The world can give 7 billion people a lifestyle of comparable quality to that presently enjoyed by Westerners. All we need is better technology and perhaps some inteligence boosting genetic engineering.

[Heraclitus]

Hundreds of millions of people live on just a dollar a day - your policies would condemn those people to a continuing life of poverty and despair - you are the people-hater!

The problem with this thinking is that the ancestors of people who live on just a dollar a day didn't on average have a better quality of life when the Earth's population was a mere billion.

[Heraclitus]

I am a huge fan of kids, and want as many as I can.

However, I also acknowledge that as many as I can, with one woman, will probably be 3-5.

Jon

You could adopt in old age after your 3-5 biological kids are all grown up. Just make sure you don't get a kid with fetal alcohol syndrome.

[Kidlicious]

So you don't deny that population control is an essential part of the environmental movement?

That is the secular argument not the Christian argument for environmentalism.

[Kidlicious]

In fact, religious groups are about the least environmentally conscious people on the planet because of their arrogant and blind faith in capitalists(s)...

fixed

[MRT144]

Hmm, all things in moderation. Fine, what do you consider appropriate?

Less than the amount you think.

[MRT144]

Nikolai, I don't expect you to always agree with me. Never have I said so.

Let's look at the flip side here.

Suppose you're gettin' dogpiled. Which side of the pile am I going to jump on?

Religious affiliation is not like a gang or codependent dysfunctional family.. You don't just support another person of the same faith because they are of the same faith.

[Kidlicious]

As many as God will provide.

Human population isn't just a function of God's will. That's the reason to be pro-life, so that more people can have life. Christians don't just leave it up to God.

[Cort Haus]

The environmental movement is one of the most anti-human movements that have ever existed.

I absolutely agree with this point. JM knows it too, as he has spoken well in the past about Malthusian misanthropy.

The consequences of humanity's industrial development has been to give better lives to more people than any other time in human history. The fact that far too many people are still in terrible poverty is because of a lack of industrialisation and development in those areas, and not because of it.

If there are messy and negative aspects to this development, then the progressive response is to seek technological fixes. A true humanist believes this to be possible, whereas the the anti-humanist seeks to blame humanity and to reverse the gains in living standards until we are all living in a semi-civilised mediaeval and backward 'eco-utopia'.

[snrjefe]

One thing that's being missed is that with better environmental stewardship, the Earth could likely support more people and perhaps free us from discussions of controlling birth rates and whatnot.

Oh yeah, obligatory Monty Python reference:

[David Floyd]

Ben, we've gone down this road before, with regards to more children being better.

Let me ask you a DIRECT, YES OR NO question:

Would the world be a better place, if the average birth rate was, say, 7 children per mother?

For bonus points, support your answer rationally.

[Ben Kenobi]

Less than the amount you think.

Ok, so you are ok with 1 under the number that God would have left you with, I take it?

[Ben Kenobi]

Would the world be a better place, if the average birth rate was, say, 7 children per mother?

Yes. Is the world better for people like Lord Kelvin?