How "Christian" of him!!

[Kidlicious]

Politics involves compromise. Islam is suppose to involve compromise, but it's not practiced that way. Chrstians are not suppose to compromise or be involved in politics the way I see it.

[Berzerker]

In this passage he's saying that he doesn't bring civil peace

similar to the passages about him bringing strife even within families... Not his intent, just the future as he saw it - followers of his teachings could or would be at odds with others who dont, including family members. Thats bound to happen when anyone successfully modifies or changes tradition and religion, thats why he was murdered in the first place.

as for Jesus being an imperialist, messiah means king of the jews, right? Kings are imperialists. That raises some questions, did Jesus use the tradition of kingship for his spiritual metaphor because of practicality or was he trying to accurately describe heaven as a monarchy?

[SlowwHand]

You forget that he denied being king of anything. People, up to and including Pilate, are the ones that called him so.

[Ben Kenobi]

Christians are not suppose to compromise or be involved in politics the way I see it.

Christians are supposed to be involved in politics but not compromise their values while doing so. Values take priority over political expediency. A Christian is to be in the world and engage the world, but is not supposed to be of the world.

[Ben Kenobi]

Not his intent, just the future as he saw it - followers of his teachings could or would be at odds with others who dont, including family members.

And that's exactly what happened. Christ wants earthly peace but not at the cost of compromising his Word. His word comes first.

As for Kingship, he explicitly says to Pilate, "my Kingdom is not of this earth". You can spin it however you want, Christ's kingdom isn't a democracy. He claims authority over everyone.

[Kidlicious]

similar to the passages about him bringing strife even within families... Not his intent, just the future as he saw it - followers of his teachings could or would be at odds with others who dont, including family members. Thats bound to happen when anyone successfully modifies or changes tradition and religion, thats why he was murdered in the first place.

His intention, as Ben mentioned, is to make christianity sweep over the world, and defeat every other religion and ideology. He say's "I am the way." In that light conflict itself is Jesus (at least in part).

as for Jesus being an imperialist, messiah means king of the jews, right? Kings are imperialists.

Only earthly, or mortal kings, are imperialists. Jesus is perfect, and therefore capable of ruling without resorting to sin.

That raises some questions, did Jesus use the tradition of kingship for his spiritual metaphor because of practicality or was he trying to accurately describe heaven as a monarchy?

Pray like this, "Thy kingdom come, on earth, as it is in heaven."

[Kidlicious]

Christians are supposed to be involved in politics but not compromise their values while doing so. Values take priority over political expediency. A Christian is to be in the world and engage the world, but is not supposed to be of the world.

That's up to the individual, but consider this verse, "Don't throw what is holy in with dogs, and don't throw your pearls to swine, or they may turn on you and trample you."

[Ben Kenobi]

"Don't throw what is holy in with dogs, and don't throw your pearls to swine, or they may turn on you and trample you."

That concerns holy teachings. Christians are still supposed to be engaged with the world.

[Kidlicious]

That concerns holy teachings.

That's ridiculous. Look at the context. Why would you just assume that he's talking about sharing scripture? No where else in the NT does he deal with that. Instead he condemns the Pharisees and the Scribes over and over again.

Christians are still supposed to be engaged with the world.

You're preaching to the chior, but you don't go to whore houses to preach, and you don't run for political office and expect to win if you are going to stick by your principles. You stick with your principles anyway, and that's how you take up the cross. Jesus did not run for office. That is not the way.

[DaShi]

More Christians should die for our sins.

[Ben Kenobi]

you don't run for political office and expect to win if you are going to stick by your principles. You stick with your principles anyway, and that's how you take up the cross. Jesus did not run for office. That is not the way.

Christians have an obligation to serve others, and I don't see why that would bar them from running for office. Yes, you stick with your principles, and yes this might cause you to lose, but there is nothing contrary to scripture with running for office.

Would it be prefereable to have a government of non-believers? Hardly. Look at the founding fathers. They were very clear that they were believers in Christ and they believed they had an obligation to govern in the name of the people.

Excluding Christians from office is no different than bigotry and discrimination.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Once again you twist an argument into something that makes you wonder if you really actually read what the person wrote at all.

[Ben Kenobi]

[action=Ben Kenobi]wonders if it's worth it to bother explaining his point knowing that Kid is having no problems following the flow of the discussion.[/action]

[action=Ben Kenobi]decides that life is too short to get into a pissing match with Imran who obviously is having a bad day. [/action]

Nice day today innit?

[MOBIUS]

BK getting annoyed when he thinks people aren't bothering to understand what he says - priceless!

Oh the delicious irony.

[Imran Siddiqui]

And besides, I'm actually having a very good day