Pope sends direct message to Ben

[Sava]

the Bible has proven to be trustworthy where it can be tested

care to give us an example?

I had a set of science encyclopedias as a kid. They had all kinds of fun experiments. I did them all.

I've read the Bible front to back. No experiments. No tests.

Funny how God would make something like the boiling point of water. 100 degrees celsius at normal pressure. You tell me, "water boils at 100 celsius". Skeptical, I ask for proof. You boil the water, measure the temp... presto! Science!

But proof of his own existence? Well that's a mystery. I'm telling you God's there. Believe me. Even this book says so! The book says you also have to hate gay people. Why, you ask?

because I said so

That's what faith is... a psychopath lying to idiots.

[Kidlicious]

Eve was not made on the 6th day, I dont believe Adam was either. There was a gap in time between the 6th day people and the events in the Garden. Adam was descended from the 6th day people, but Eve was not - she came from God and Adam's rib.

They weren't kicked out for disobedience, here's the text:



Nothing in there about disobedience, Ben... Course it doesn't say they were kicked out for the ability to procreate, but thats what the fig leaves represent.

You need to interpret in the context of the entire Bible. Your interpretation is very bad. The creation story means something specific to Christians.

[Ben Kenobi]

care to give us an example?

Plenty of them, perhaps the best known is that the bible spoke of the existence of the Assyrians before their existence was confirmed archaeologically

[Nikolai]

Yep, plenty of them. Lots of historical facts that has since been confirmed.

[Berzerker]

Your assertion that the command be fruitful and multiply doesn't apply to Adam and Eve is untenable. Why would God compel these supposed 'six day people', and not Adam and Eve? It stretches credibility.

If Adam and Eve were the only 2 people made on the 6th Day and they were told to be fruitful and fill the Earth, why didn't they? They didn't do what God told them, instead God took the Adam to the Garden where he had no woman to be fruitful and fill the Earth. How do you explain that? Genesis says the 6th Day people were made in God's image - male and female. But Eve wasn't made until after God planted a Garden and took the man there to work. And how can Adam subdue the Earth and all the critters etc if he's stuck working in the Garden? None of the instructions God gave to the 6th Day people were being followed by Adam, instead God took him to his Garden and gave him different instructions - till the Garden and dont eat from the tree of knowledge.

You can believe whatever you like. There's no evidence for your presupposition.

According to Mesopotamian mythology the first peoples were primitive workers made to labor for the gods. Later on the Serpent god made "Adapa" - perfected man - and he refused the tree of life fearing it was actually poison. Adapa = Adam. But even the Bible supports what I'm saying, male and female were made on the 6th Day and told to fill the Earth. But Eve wasn't there yet... Neither was Adam:

Gen 2:7 "And Jehovah God formeth the man -- dust from the ground, and breatheth into his nostrils breath of life, and the man becometh a living creature. 8 And Jehovah God planteth a garden in Eden, at the east, and He setteth there the man whom He hath formed"

That all happened after the 7th Day.

The first chapter is written as an overview of creation. The second, the specific story of Adam and Eve. Are you really this dense, Berz? Two different chapters, two different stories.

Adam and Eve weren't made together and neither were doing what God told the 6th Day people

This is false.

"Then the Lord God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being."

Genesis 2:7

"Then"?

Genesis 2 even goes on to explicitly refute your crap.

"That is why a man leaves his father and mother and is united to his wife, and they become one flesh."

You were wrong about that too, they became one flesh because Eve came from Adam's rib.

Yes. They were. Had they obeyed they would have stayed in.

God never said that... He told Adam he'd die the day he touched the tree of knowledge and the serpent told them they'd become like God knowing good and evil. So what happened? I'll quote God:

"And Jehovah God saith, `Lo, the man was as one of Us, as to the knowledge of good and evil; and now, lest he send forth his hand, and have taken also of the tree of life, and eaten, and lived to the age,' -- 23 Jehovah God sendeth him forth from the garden of Eden to serve the ground from which he hath been taken; 24 yea, he casteth out the man, and causeth to dwell at the east of the garden of Eden the cherubs and the flame of the sword which is turning itself round to guard the way of the tree of life."

So they got kicked out because God didn't want them eating from the tree of life

[Ben Kenobi]

If Adam and Eve were the only 2 people made on the 6th Day and they were told to be fruitful and fill the Earth, why didn't they?

They did.

They didn't do what God told them, instead God took the Adam to the Garden where he had no woman to be fruitful and fill the Earth.

Christ, the story lays it out. God created Adam and then created Eve. Adam was already in the garden before God made Eve.

Genesis says the 6th Day people were made in God's image - male and female.

And on the 7th he rested. How is that inconsistent with the account in Genesis 2 that goes into further detail about the creation of man?

But Eve wasn't made until after God planted a Garden and took the man there to work. And how can Adam subdue the Earth and all the critters etc if he's stuck working in the Garden?

In what sense would his descendants be confined to the garden? It makes sense if you have one man and one woman to give them safe shelter in the Garden.

None of the instructions God gave to the 6th Day people were being followed by Adam

Ridiculous. Adam did have children with Eve.

till the Garden and dont eat from the tree of knowledge.

Prior to the creation of Eve, yes. Then God decided that Adam needed a helpmeet, and made Eve.

[Ben Kenobi]

According to Mesopotamian mythology the first peoples were primitive workers made to labor for the gods.

#fail

You were wrong about that too, they became one flesh because Eve came from Adam's rib.

It is curious how Jesus's words are exactly found in Genesis 3. That's the whole entire point.

God never said that

Uh. Yeah, he totally did. Reread Genesis 3. I realize it means discarding your crappy theology, but seriously, Berz. There's nothing to justify your position.

[kentonio]

Why would God need rest? Isn't he supposed to be omnipotent? That's the problem with gods these day, they're just lazy.

[Ben Kenobi]

Why would God need rest? Isn't he supposed to be omnipotent? That's the problem with gods these day, they're just lazy

Who says he rested because he was tired?

[DinoDoc]

Why would God need rest? Isn't he supposed to be omnipotent? That's the problem with gods these day, they're just lazy.

Haven't you ever wanted to sit down with a beer and watch a football game?

[Berzerker]

They did.

No they didn't, Eve wasn't even there yet. She was made in the Garden, the 6th Day people were made to the west of the Garden - which lines up well with Ethiopia as our ancestral homeland. Go figure! Now, explain that Ben. How can male and female appear on the 6th Day west of the Garden and then we're told Eve was made after Adam and she was made in the Garden? Either thats a contradiction or it means Eve was not among the 6th Day people.

And Adam wasn't doing anything God told the 6th Day people. He wasn't being fruitful and subduing the Earth, he was taken by God to the Garden to work and only then did God consider a companion from among the animals. None was found so God made Eve. The 6th Day man didn't have to watch a parade of animals walk by so he could find a mate, male and female were made in the image of the gods on the same day.

Christ, the story lays it out. God created Adam and then created Eve. Adam was already in the garden before God made Eve.

The 6th Day people were made together, male and female, and they were made westward from the Garden. Eve was made in the Garden.

And on the 7th he rested. How is that inconsistent with the account in Genesis 2 that goes into further detail about the creation of man?

The account in Gen 2 came after the 6th Day, its about 2 specific people as opposed to the 6th Day people that were already being fruitful and filling the Earth. Or is it "replenish" the Earth. How can you replenish a world devoid of people?

In what sense would his descendants be confined to the garden? It makes sense if you have one man and one woman to give them safe shelter in the Garden.

Adam was confined to the Garden, he had no descendents yet. Why would God tell Adam and Eve to fill the world and then take Adam to work in the Garden? He cant fill the world from the Garden. And Adam got kicked out once he did have descendents. The first thing Genesis says they did was conceive kids. So we have some sexual knowledge or ability given to Adam and Eve and it results in children and their ouster from the Garden.

Ridiculous. Adam did have children with Eve.

Only after they got kicked out of the Garden, the 6th Day people were already out there filling the Earth. Thats why Cain was worried someone would kill him in retaliation for Abel and thats how he found a wife.

Prior to the creation of Eve, yes. Then God decided that Adam needed a helpmeet, and made Eve.

But Eve wasn't made west of the Garden with Adam

It is curious how Jesus's words are exactly found in Genesis 3. That's the whole entire point.

Jesus didn't quote Gen 3

[Kidlicious]

Why would God need rest? Isn't he supposed to be omnipotent? That's the problem with gods these day, they're just lazy.

Why couldn't you get the point, even if it hit you in the face?

[Kidlicious]

care to give us an example?

I had a set of science encyclopedias as a kid. They had all kinds of fun experiments. I did them all.

I've read the Bible front to back. No experiments. No tests.

Funny how God would make something like the boiling point of water. 100 degrees celsius at normal pressure. You tell me, "water boils at 100 celsius". Skeptical, I ask for proof. You boil the water, measure the temp... presto! Science!

But proof of his own existence? Well that's a mystery. I'm telling you God's there. Believe me. Even this book says so! The book says you also have to hate gay people. Why, you ask?

because I said so

That's what faith is... a psychopath lying to idiots.

First, faith is a human way of thinking. Normal human beings make decisions in the face of uncertainty everyday.

Second, I think we are all a bit sick of your nonsense about us hating gays. The Bible does not say to hate gays. A few Christians here have told you they love gays. What is wrong with you? Are you retarded?

[Berzerker]

27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them. 28 And God blessed them. And God said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth

the 6th Day, Gen 1:27

7 then the LORD God formed the man of dust from the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living creature. 8 And the LORD God planted a garden in Eden, in the east, and there he put the man whom he had formed.

Gen 2:7

So the man was made west of the Garden and taken from that location eastward to the Garden. What happened to the woman?

18 Then the LORD God said, "It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for him." 19 Now out of the ground the LORD God had formed every beast of the field and every bird of the heavens and brought them to the man to see what he would call them. And whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name. 20 The man gave names to all livestock and to the birds of the heavens and to every beast of the field. But for Adam there was not found a helper fit for him. 21 So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and while he slept took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh. 22 And the rib that the LORD God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man. 23 Then the man said, "This at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man." 24 Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh. 25 And the man and his wife were both naked and were not ashamed.

Gen 2:18 - That aint the same creation story in Gen 1:27, Adam was created west of the Garden and taken there, Eve was created in the Garden after Adam couldn't find a companion from among the animals he was naming.

Adam's ancestors were African

[Kidlicious]

Berzerker, "Adam" means mankind. It's the creation story of mankind. The whole story reads like that.