How "Christian" of him!!

[Ben Kenobi]

The original Virginia Company charter pretty much included the entire area of the United States and Canada. In fact Virginia colonists and militia subdued the native americans on both sides of the Potomac river in the 1620's, making settlement of the area possible. The first ships sent by Lord Calvert arrived in 1636 - they contained more Protestants than Catholics. Maryland wasn't a "Catholic Colony", in fact it's Maryland Toleration Act made it the one colony of its time that accepted all trinitarian Christians.

Unlike the other colonies which explicitly excluded Catholics from their charter. Naturally, Maryland became, along with Rhode Island, a haven for Catholics to escape the religious persecution in England under the Tudors.

[Ben Kenobi]

They later gave up authority to the british.

Lord Baltimore was British.

No, because by your own arguments, britsh authority was inherited by the federal government.

No, it wasn't. They fought a Revolutionary war to establish federal authority apart from the British Government. WRT to Canada, the situation is quite a bit different.

I'm pretty sure the pope at one time recognised the king's rule over England,

No, they never did. What they did do is accept that the Hanoverians were the legitimate rulers of England, in 1801 when George III dropped the claim to the throne of France during the Act of Union.

As far as the Vatican is concerned, they do not recognise the Act of Supremacy which excludes Catholic heirs of the Electress Sophia. IIRC, they do recognise the heirs of the Electress Sophia as legitimate, but I will have to look that up.

[Kidlicious]

Christ said that the reason they were ruled by foreigners was punishment for their disobedience.

Indeed. We are all ruled by other men because of our disobedience to God.

God in his mercy chose to grant them a godly king as that was their wish, even though such was contrary to what God wanted for them.

Where does it say that Saul was godly, and what about other kings.

[Kidlicious]

[Q=Kidicious;5726382]To collect tax for a gentile king that is ruling over a foreign land is certainly to sin and therefore to deny the Christ.[/Q] No. "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, and unto God what is God's."

The only way "render" can mean what you think it means is if the translationated word in Greek actually means that, and I don't think it does. I also believe that Christ was talking about rendering more than taxes to Caesar. He meant everything that is Caesar's goes back to Rome.

[Kidlicious]

At least two translations don't use the word render but give.

[Kidlicious]

Ben,

Christ said to Paul, "why do you persecute me?" So if you are saying that if Rome persecutes Christians that they should obey their masters?

[Kidlicious]

He built the Church and the law.

And Constantine transformed it.

[Ben Kenobi]

Where does it say that Saul was godly, and what about other kings.

After Samuel anointed him.

1 Sam 10:9-11

As Saul turned to leave Samuel, God changed Saul's heart, and all these signs were fulfilled that day. When they arrived at Gibeah, a procession of prophets met him; the Spirit of God came upon him in power, and he joined in their prophesying. When all those who had formerly known him saw him prophesying with the prophets, they asked each other, "What is this that has happened to the son of Kish? Is Saul also among the prophets?"

As for the other kings, David, Solomon and Josiah King of Judah were also acclaimed as godly kings, although only David and Solomon were kings of a united Israel.

[Ben Kenobi]

The only way "render" can mean what you think it means is if the translationated word in Greek actually means that, and I don't think it does. I also believe that Christ was talking about rendering more than taxes to Caesar. He meant everything that is Caesar's goes back to Rome.

It's a pun.

Ἀπόδοτε οὖν τὰ Καίσαρος Καίσαρι καὶ τὰ τοῦ Θεοῦ τῷ Θεῷ

Apodote = Render/pay.

[Ben Kenobi]

Christ said to Paul, "why do you persecute me?" So if you are saying that if Rome persecutes Christians that they should obey their masters?

Recall Christ's answer to Pilate.

Jesus answered, "You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above. Therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin."

There is only one Master, and that is God. All the lesser masters serve under the Greater Master. You are thereby obliged to obey their orders such as they do not contradict those of their true Master.

[Ben Kenobi]

And Constantine transformed it.

Don't you mean Theodosius?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Well Constantine was the one who forced Nicene Creed to be formulated...

[Kitschum]

It's a pun.

Ἀπόδοτε οὖν τὰ Καίσαρος Καίσαρι καὶ τὰ τοῦ Θεοῦ τῷ Θεῷ

Apodote = Render/pay.

As far as I can tell, that is literally: "Return then those (things that are) of Caesar to Caesar and those of God to God"

The prefix apo- lends the verb a sense of "give back, return, pay back" similar to the Latin re-. Whether that is sufficiently covered by "render" I can't say.

'Those' is in the plural accusative neuter, suggesting a general applicability, but it does not explicitly say that 'everything that belongs to Caesar/God must return to Caesar/God'. Like so often in the Bible the interpretation of the particulars is left rather open.

[Ben Kenobi]

Well Constantine was the one who forced Nicene Creed to be formulated...

Perhaps you are referring to Arius...

[Imran Siddiqui]

Perhaps you are referring to Arius...

Who convened the First Council of Nicaea?