Nicolai, JM and such, I have an honest question.

[SlowwHand]

Methodist.

[Nikolai]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
With a nick like Nikolai, you'll have to forgive me for the error.

I was curious why Spec asked you and JM about the pope, and not me or Heresson.

It's my name actually. It's not only tzar's who is named Nikolai.

[Straybow]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
It is, the early Christian's were very socialist. I will agree that you have to modify Marx to be a Marxist and a Christian. However, I think that it is very obvious that you have to modify Marx to apply his philosophy to modern society period.

Buuzzzzt! Wrong!

Socialism is forcing people to "share" by removing property rights, etc. Christianity is choosing to give or share from one's own possessions and earnings.

[self biased]

Originally posted by Asher

Religion is about endless depths of fantasy. It is a waste of time to learn more about them in detail, just as it is a waste of time to learn more about the lives of LARP people.

i'd put the LARPers higher up on that list. they tend to be more tolerant of what they view as a different culture, in my experience.

[Jon Miller]

Originally posted by Straybow

Originally posted by Jon Miller
It is, the early Christian's were very socialist. I will agree that you have to modify Marx to be a Marxist and a Christian. However, I think that it is very obvious that you have to modify Marx to apply his philosophy to modern society period.

Buuzzzzt! Wrong!

Socialism is forcing people to "share" by removing property rights, etc. Christianity is choosing to give or share from one's own possessions and earnings.

I think you don't understand what socialism is. Many of the more successful socialist communities were not states, and if you read the New Testament, many people gave everything they had to the church, and were than cared for by the church.

State Socialism, is where the people all decide to do so, for that state. Christianity is very open about the state doing what it wills.. "render to caeser what is caesers" and all that.

Jon Miller

[LordShiva]

CHRISTIAN FIGHT!!!! :Popcorn:

[DanS]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
We used to all be one church, the Orthodox say it was them and the Catholics say it was them. Catholics and Orthodox split just after the first milennium. Then all the different protestant churches split around the half point of the second millenium BC.

Careful. The orthodox are schismatics. The protestants left the church. Important distinction.

[Colonâ„¢]

Is that sarcasm?

*clueless heathen talking*

[Ben Kenobi]

Careful. The orthodox are schismatics. The protestants left the church. Important distinction.

Yes, I thought that was implied in how I phrased the wording. Protestants make no claim to be the True church as the Orthodox do. They deny that the body of Christ can be visibly unified.

[Jon Miller]

We claim that Christians are members of one church even if the administration and other such things are different.

JM

[Nostromo]

Re: Re: Nicolai, JM and such, I have an honest question.

Originally posted by Nikolai
But I have no problem with Christianity promoting sex first after the marriage. I think God knows what is best for us. Not that it nessessarily is easy, but quite a few problems in the world would cease if we humans did what God told us. But, as we all know, the world is not perfect. I believe that is because if sin, because that's what God tells me in the Bible. This is faith, not logic, so while I can defend my standpoint to a degree, there is a gap between faith and human understanding that cannot be filled by us. That's the frustrating part, faith cannot be understood completely from the outside.

Like William James pointed out in the Will to believe you cannot live your life relying only on rationnally justified beliefs. And, in certain cases, its perfectly sensible to believe something, even though you can't justify it rationally.

But that doesn't mean that you must turn your brain off when you read the Bible and accept all of it as THE WORD OF GOD. For example, do you eat porc? The old testament tells you not to eat porc. But Jesus explains in the Gospels that its cool to eat porc. So what's the rule here. Do what the old testament tells you, unless Jesus tells you otherwise? But you could also use your head. Does the old testament even explain to you why eating porc is bad for you? If so, are these reasons valid today?

If you take the Bible too literally, you risk transforming your religion in a cheap superstition.

The Bible tell us of many kinds of sins; lies, adultery, love of money before people, murder. And homosexuality. Unfortunately I'd almost say. It's hard for me to understand how it can be a sin. How can it be so bad, when it feels so good? But God's own word tells me it's so. And then I am ready to accept that. But does that make me obliged to hate gays? To frown upon them? No, God's word tells me to care for all people, gays just as much as anyone else. It tells me all sins are unacceptable to God, he is holy and cannot tolerate it.

[DanS]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
We claim that Christians are members of one church even if the administration and other such things are different.

JM

RCs would generally view the orthodox, as schismatics, as much closer to communion than the protestants, who left the church.

This state of affairs has been disrupted somewhat with the recent Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification, which was mostly the RC church agreeing with the protestant position on justification.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Declaration_on_the_Doctrine_of_Justification

[Nikolai]

You can't just alter other's post you know, someone could believe it was what I wrote.

Other than that, no, I do not turn my brains off. But the Christian faith is a core belief for me, and faith cannot be understood from the outside, and will often be seen as unlogical. As for the pork question, well, if Jesus says it different, then that part of the OT is changed. There also is different kinds of commandments, some are given to the Jews as a people in their current situation, some are given to all humans on an universal basis. But that is theology on a higher level, so you probalby should ask someone with more expertice on it than me.

As for taking the Bible literally, well, there are parts that are to be taken litterally and parts that are not. God gave us a brain, I suspect there were a reason.

[Jon Miller]

Originally posted by DanS


RCs would generally view the orthodox, as schismatics, as much closer to communion than the protestants, who left the church.

This state of affairs has been disrupted somewhat with the recent Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification, which was mostly the RC church agreeing with the protestant position on justification.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Declaration_on_the_Doctrine_of_Justification

SDA's are more allowing for open communion than Catholics. Like I had to cross my arms and be blessed by the bishop (I think) at the Catholic Mass I went to, while anyone can take part in the SDA communion.

Now, we do believe in baptism, so while members of other denominations which wish to join can just do so by profession of faith, Catholics must get rebaptised (since infant baptism doesn't count).

Jon Miller

[Straybow]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
I think you don't understand what socialism is.

I know what socialism is, which differs considerably from what socialists say.