Alexander

[Ray K]

Simple questions...

Did Alexander primarily speak Greek, or Macedonian?

Did he propagate Greek culture throughout his empire, or Macedonian?

[MarkG]

Re: Re: Re: Alexander

Originally posted by dino_2d
I dont think taht macedonians were alowed to participate in the games on the bigining.

# King Alexander I, in the 80th Olympics, in 460 BCE. He run the “Stadion” and was placed very close second.
# King Arhelaos Perdikas, competed in the 93rd Olympics, in 408 BCE and won at Delphi the race of the four-horse chariot.
# King Philip II was an Olympic champion three times. In the 106th Olympics, in 356 BCE, he won the race, riding his horse. In the 107th Olympics, in 352 BCE, he won the four-horse chariot race. In the 108th Olympics, in 348 BCE, he was the winner of the two colt chariot.
# Cliton run the Stadion in the 113rd Olympics, in 328 BCE.
# Damasias from Amphipolis won in the Stadion in the 115th Olympics, in 320 BCE.
# Lampos from Philippi, was proclaimed a winner in the four-horse chariot race in the 119th Olympics, in 304 BCE.
# Antigonos won in the Stadion race, in the 122nd Olympics, in 292 BCE and in the 123rd Olympics in 288 BCE.
# Seleucos won in the field-sports competition in the 128th Olympics in 268 BCE.
During the 128th Olympics, in 268 BCE and in the 129th Olympics, in 264 BCE, a woman from Macedonia won the competition. Pausanias mentions that: “…it is said that the race of the two-colt chariot was won by a woman, named Velestihi from the seashores of Macedonia”.

[Nickiow]

Re: Re: Re: Alexander

Originally posted by dino_2d


I dont think taht macedonians were alowed to participate in the games on the bigining.
Here is nice site:
www.eurominority.org

Thanks for the link, i gather your pov is more centerd on more recent history, mine is from a different perspective.

Its a matter of record that a Macedonian won an Olympic award before the rise of Alexander however, to be fair once rome was in control romans coulod compete as well, nero won a 4 horse race despite falling out of the Chariot and not finishing....but thats a lot different from the time i referenced, when Greeks said who was greeks and could enter the Olympic.

Books like The Macedonian State : origins, institutions, and history N.G.L. Hammond and his other many works on Greece make mention of the idea of natinality in the ancient world, very different from how we understand it today, Classical sites such as http://collection.nlc-bnc.ca/100/201....html#noframes haver papers on the issue of identity for the greeks, why were so many in service as mercenary against their origin of birth for instance and was the concept of identity to employer and fellow mercs a factor that was stonger than birth state origin.

[Nickiow]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Alexander

Originally posted by MarkG

# King Alexander I, in the 80th Olympics, in 460 BCE. He run the “Stadion” and was placed very close second.
# King Arhelaos Perdikas, competed in the 93rd Olympics, in 408 BCE and won at Delphi the race of the four-horse chariot.
# King Philip II was an Olympic champion three times. In the 106th Olympics, in 356 BCE, he won the race, riding his horse. In the 107th Olympics, in 352 BCE, he won the four-horse chariot race. In the 108th Olympics, in 348 BCE, he was the winner of the two colt chariot.
# Cliton run the Stadion in the 113rd Olympics, in 328 BCE.
# Damasias from Amphipolis won in the Stadion in the 115th Olympics, in 320 BCE.
# Lampos from Philippi, was proclaimed a winner in the four-horse chariot race in the 119th Olympics, in 304 BCE.
# Antigonos won in the Stadion race, in the 122nd Olympics, in 292 BCE and in the 123rd Olympics in 288 BCE.
# Seleucos won in the field-sports competition in the 128th Olympics in 268 BCE.
During the 128th Olympics, in 268 BCE and in the 129th Olympics, in 264 BCE, a woman from Macedonia won the competition. Pausanias mentions that: “…it is said that the race of the two-colt chariot was won by a woman, named Velestihi from the seashores of Macedonia”.

Nice list, the arguments that Phillip gave for his first participation are quite intresting as well.

[DinoDoc]

Hi, dino!

[MarkG]

Originally posted by Ray K
Did Alexander primarily speak Greek, or Macedonian?

the only language found in ancient macedonians cities is greek. all the king and city names are greek, etc etc etc..

[Nickiow]

Originally posted by MarkG
the only language found in ancient macedonians cities is greek. all the king and city names are greek, etc etc etc..

Dialetcs from the same root branch, Alex greek turors found no problem undertstanding each other now did they.

[MarkG]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Alexander

Originally posted by Nickiow
the arguments that Phillip gave for his first participation are quite intresting as well.

could you be more exact?

[dino_2d]

Originally posted by MarkG
the only language found in ancient macedonians cities is greek. all the king and city names are greek, etc etc etc..

The only writen not spoken language that is and not in the early macedonia but the later macedonia.
It is fact that Helens in that time had developed culture and alphabet and macedonians were barabarians.
I am writing English on this forum but i am not englishman and if someone read this forum after 2000 years can u imagine the impresion.

[dino_2d]

and why is my picture still waiting for aproval

[MarkG]

Originally posted by dino_2d
The only writen not spoken language that is and not in the early macedonia but the later macedonia.
It is fact that Helens in that time had developed culture and alphabet and macedonians were barabarians.

what kind of evidence do you have of a language which was not written???

but i dont get it. are you now agreeing with the theory that macedonians where helenized?

[dino_2d]

No ofcourse not but you take something from civilisations that are culturaly more developed than you that is also happening today.
But thank you for addmiting that we are talking about two separate ethnicums here becouse if you helenize someone that means that he is not born as a helene but you made him one.

[Nickiow]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Alexander

Originally posted by MarkG
could you be more exact?

Well i was making the point that before Alexander come along, Macedonians had argued they were as good a Greek as the next, some Greeks did not agree, and the reasons for each have survived.

There was objections from some quarters and Phillip had to put his case to them so as to cempete in the Olympics and settle for all that the Macedonians were as good a Greek as any other and able to compete. Demosthones iirc is the primary source.http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cache/p...eco-Roman.html

[Nickiow]

Originally posted by dino_2d

But thank you for addmiting that we are talking about two separate ethnicums here becouse if you helenize someone that means that he is not born as a helene but you made him one.

Not a profitable argument though, in Alexanders time and before the Macedonians considered themselves Hellens and not Barbarians, they argue that they were the same as other Greeks, not that they had become adapted hellenic culture and become hellens.

Trojans, in your example, founded Rome, does that make Roman culture Trojan?. Would a 6 Cent Etruscan disagree?, more than a Pope of the 1600s? or less than the Deuce?.

Do you have an argument on linguistic, genitic study, or population movements, or just old fashoned history?, if so please share it so we can all profit from it.

[dino_2d]

And thanx again for not putting Macedonians and Greeks in the same basket