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Yes, they used nerve gas, however what type of them is classified.
So no, it wasn't a clean operation... However Russia probably won't admit that.
So no, it wasn't a clean operation... However Russia probably won't admit that.
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Seems like a well carried out op by the Russians, only the aftermath still shows traces of the Soviet-era lack of accountability.
And BTW, I heard somewhere that not using the word terrorist in press reports is to protect reporters in "hot spots". A reasonable policy IMO, unless one wants to go get the news on site personally...
"On this ship you'll refer to me as idiot, not you captain!"
- Lone StarComment
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The Russians used sleeping gas.
It definitely was nearly a clean operation... but the problem was Sonic, since you are in apparent denial, there were 50 gunman.
ACCEPT THE FACTS.
For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)Comment
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what's that?The Russians used sleeping gas.
anyway it did more than just make them fall asleep, the majority of hostages are hospitalized.CSPAComment
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Fez, no, even in news it was claimed they used nerve gas. In interview some chief of Lithuanian counter terrorist force ("YPT" or "Aitvaras") said that the aftermath wouldn't be so after sleeping gas and that definitely nerve gas was used.Comment
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Sleeping gas causes disorientation... it is like nerve gas... well actually it is a type of nerve gas...Originally posted by Gangerolf
what's that?
anyway it did more than just make them fall asleep, the majority of hostages are hospitalized.
Nerve gas isn't that bad... I got hit with a canister fired by riot police before when in Ecuador...
The casualities I believe were minimized. And the Russians conducted an excellent operation. Before you go on your personal crusades think.For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)Comment
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I don't think there is such a thing as "stun gas" or "sleeping gas". The concentrations needed to make medical anesthetic gases effective is too high to be practical in this type of usage. On the other hand what I generally think as "nerve gas", such as Sabun are way too dangerous for this sort of usage."I say shoot'em all and let God sort it out in the end!Comment
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Wait a minute... nerve gas would actually be referring to chemical weapons... like what Saddam Hussein uses. The stuff the Russians most likely used for this crisis was tear gas.For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)Comment
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Here are a few links of smoke grenades that only let out smoke (non lethal):
American Varients:
Can't find anything on Russian stuff... probably similar to what the US has...For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)Comment
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Anesthesia is actually quite dangerous. Hospitals always recommend people not to eat and drink for at least 6 hours before it is applied. Paientsunder full narcosis usually can't breathe on their own and need to be artificially supplied with oxygen. Finally, there are people who react very badly to anesthetics.Comment
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Doc, could CO2 do this? I've heard it's more toxic in concentration than most people realize.Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
I don't think there is such a thing as "stun gas" or "sleeping gas". The concentrations needed to make medical anesthetic gases effective is too high to be practical in this type of usage. On the other hand what I generally think as "nerve gas", such as Sabun are way too dangerous for this sort of usage.No, I did not steal that from somebody on Something Awful.Comment
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You'd have to use enough to partially displace the oxygen in the atmosphere. I think you have to replace about 5 to 10% of the gas volume with the CO2 to cause asphyxia. In a place as big as a theater that would be a lot of gas. Assuming a space 200 by 100 by 20 feet that would be 20,000 to 40,000 cubic feet of CO2.Originally posted by The Mad Monk
Doc, could CO2 do this? I've heard it's more toxic in concentration than most people realize."I say shoot'em all and let God sort it out in the end!Comment
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You intubate them first. Generally they give the victim "pre-medication" which includes an anti-cholinergic to reduce secretions and a sedative to make them drowsy. That's followed by a quick IV sedative like Valium to put him down sufficiently enough to allow the placement on an endotracheal tube.Originally posted by Lord Merciless
Anesthesia is actually quite dangerous. Hospitals always recommend people not to eat and drink for at least 6 hours before it is applied. Paientsunder full narcosis usually can't breathe on their own and need to be artificially supplied with oxygen. Finally, there are people who react very badly to anesthetics.
I learned this watching "ER". You should watch it too. It's very educational, and often accurate as well."I say shoot'em all and let God sort it out in the end!Comment
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The Russians used sleeping gas.Sleeping gas causes disorientationfalse, false and false. 150+ people died because of the gas. Also, it worked way too fast for standard tear gas. In the waco raid, many were killed by the tear gas. However, that took some time to set in, while this gas killed instantly. Some of the people didn't even get time to get up out of their chair when the gas hit them, that's NOT the case with tear gas. Also, the number of deads do not correspond with the normal ammount of people allergic to tear gas.The stuff the Russians most likely used for this crisis was tear gas.
something else was used here...something not quite so innocent as simple tear gas...Quod Me Nutrit Me DestruitComment
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118 hostages + 50 terrorists dead...that's 168 people.
CNN links nerve gas to the deaths...
Putin: "Please forgive us. The memory of the victims must unite all of us."
the Russian interior minister admitted the use of sleep induced nerve gas. Strange that more people died than fell asleep...
Quod Me Nutrit Me DestruitComment
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