SF throws down the gauntlet to Cali

[Ben Kenobi]

They are still seperate issues. You can take any issues and link them, but it doesn't negate that marriage is about the union of a couple (hell, of a group even), and procreation is about the forming of life. Marriage does not form life.

Funny word, union.

Consider that for a minute.

Can the union be properly consummated? If you argue that the union is the only point, then you must alter the union to fit this change.

The union is not the same, and one of the indicators, that the union is different is that no children come from it.

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


So why should we allow something if it is not something that ought to be done?

It is about what they ought to do. That's the whole debate. You argue they ought to marry, while I would say that they should not.

Anything else is meaningless.

What if they say that you ought to not get married? Why is your opinion more valid than their opinion?

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Jaguar Warrior
It's not the same.

I never get him angry enough to say something funny to me.

Maybe he s you? I'd keep an eye on your inbox if I were you.

[Giancarlo]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


So how can I win? By being silent, so that you feel more confortable Fez? By being more outspoken than I am already?

You have no right to infringe on my constitutional rights. You have no right to infringe on the constitutional rights of any gay person. Go voice your opinion. Voice it till you turn blue.

I'm just blind to it, I think... it shouldn't really matter who one sleeps with, unless it causes problems for the person. And there are people who feel trapped by the lifestyle, even if you feel satisfied.

Feel trapped? What kind of B.S land do you live on?

No, and no. But I don't know if you can understand. I do this not to condemn you, but rather to show you another option, that no one will really talk about because it is unpopular.

You are not going to strip my constitutional rights away. What you propose is no option at all.

[Ben Kenobi]

What if they say that you ought to not get married? Why is your opinion more valid than their opinion?

That's what the whole debate has been. What are my reasons? How are they different? Why should they not be treated the same.

If the reasons make sense, you ought to abide by them. If they do not, then I need to make better points.

Consider this, where in any thread, have you seen one of the supporters of gay marriage showing you the good that will come from this change?

[Giancarlo]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


Funny word, union.

Consider that for a minute.

Can the union be properly consummated? If you argue that the union is the only point, then you must alter the union to fit this change.

The union is not the same, and one of the indicators, that the union is different is that no children come from it.

Civil unions are constitutionally inadequate as they are not applied in every state as marriage.

[The Mad Monk]

It seems to me that pissing off a sizable voting bloc, and other, sympathetic blocs in the state, as well as going against his actor's instincts to do the popular thing, all to uphold an oath of office many find to just be window dressing, is a commendable thing.

[Giancarlo]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Consider this, where in any thread, have you seen one of the supporters of gay marriage showing you the good that will come from this change?

And what exactly is so evil about gay marriage? How the hell will it harm you?

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


That's what the whole debate has been. What are my reasons? How are they different? Why should they not be treated the same.

If the reasons make sense, you ought to abide by them. If they do not, then I need to make better points.

Consider this, where in any thread, have you seen one of the supporters of gay marriage showing you the good that will come from this change?

What was the bad again?

[Agathon]

@ the fascist trying to defend constitutional rights.

[Ben Kenobi]

You have no right to infringe on my constitutional rights.

What constitutional right? Where is this right enshrined in the constitution of the United States?

Feel trapped? What kind of B.S land do you live on?

There is such thing as a formerly gay person, Fez.

Civil unions are constitutionally inadequate as they are not applied in every state as marriage.

WOOOSHHH!!!

Missed the point entirely, Fez. Read the post more carefully.

And what exactly is so evil about gay marriage?

Real list of positive benefits there Fez.

Could you at least try to answer the question?

[Giancarlo]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


What constitutional right? Where is this right enshrined in the constitution of the United States?

Equal protection clause.

There is such thing as a formerly gay person, Fez.

No there isn't. If you actually believe the crap you type, seek help. Gay people cannot be "cured".

Real list of positive benefits there Fez.

Could you at least try to answer the question?

I am waiting for the negatives.

Why don't you try to at least answer questions?

[Giancarlo]

Originally posted by Agathon
@ the fascist trying to defend constitutional rights.

F**k you. I am no fascist.

[DaShi]

I think he was referring to me.

[Imran Siddiqui]

No doubt the majority of everyone else would be standing around appreciating the warmth as you slowly toasted.

Well, at the very least I'd have marshmellows on a stick as he was toasting. I'm not totally heartless .

@ the fascist trying to defend constitutional rights.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who found that ironic .