2K Games Announces Sid Meier's Civilization IV: Warlords.

[Son of David]

It would be funny if the Vassal State as depicted in the Julius Caesar screenshot has since been cut out of the expansion.

I wonder how many here would still buy the expansion? After all, it seems to be mostly just 6 average-sounding scenarios and six new civs. No word on any desperately-needed changes to nuclear weapons for example. Ho hum.

[Footie Mad]

I trust Firaxis to make some good new content, my one and only request is that I want there be an even larger difference beteween how the civs act and behave. The adding of unique civ buildings is a step in the right direction, I don't care about many different leader faces if they all act similar. I want different opponents!

[Alexander I]

Yeah, most of them seem to act the same way: uncooperative and non-committal, yet largely passive.

With of course, the exception of Montezuma, who is bizarrely aggressive.

[Son of David]

Does anyone else agree with me that Firaxis should take the nuclear weapons question into hand?

Or is that something players should mod themselves if they are not happy with it? I want my late-game nukes to be useful for something.

[Alexander I]

Yes. What good are nukes that don't kill anything?

[fed1943]

The threat is stronger than actual play...
Best regards,

[Alexander I]

Originally posted by fed1943
The threat is stronger than actual play...
Best regards,

I haven't found nukes to be worth anything. Oh, no! He's going to nuke me. Sigh...

[Willem]

Originally posted by padillah
Maybe this is just another civic. Currently it goes straight from Slavery to freedom, maybe they are looking for the civic in between.

Um, costs less than slavery but ups hammers by 50% ? 100% ?

Tom P.

No, in the screen shot it appeared in the tradable items screen, along with Open Borders. Besides, there's already a Vassalage civic, having two that are so similiar would be very confusing.

[Willem]

Originally posted by fed1943
The threat is stronger than actual play...
Best regards,

Kind of like real life eh?

[Alexander I]

Originally posted by Willem


Kind of like real life eh?

Sigh. I didn't think we played games so we could replicate reality perpetually...

[padillah]

Originally posted by Willem


No, in the screen shot it appeared in the tradable items screen, along with Open Borders. Besides, there's already a Vassalage civic, having two that are so similiar would be very confusing.

Yeah, I found the screenshot.

Hmm, what good is it going to be? Can I remain autonomous and still be a vassal state? Is this going to help me rebuild so I can come back later in the game?

Being under the Peace Treaty it looks like something that might last for 10 tunrs or so but what happens in those ten turns?

We need more info. Hey, Locutus. What else don't you know?

Tom P.

[Willem]

Originally posted by padillah

Hmm, what good is it going to be? Can I remain autonomous and still be a vassal state? Is this going to help me rebuild so I can come back later in the game?

I don't think you'd want to become a vassal state yourself, it's used for civs that are weaker than you. You would have the choice of either destroying them or turning them into vassals.

Being under the Peace Treaty it looks like something that might last for 10 tunrs or so but what happens in those ten turns?

It's bound to last a lot longer than 10 turns. Once a civ becomes a vassal, it will remain so until it manages to revolt in some way and regains it's freedom. Think of it in terms of the relation of the eastern European nations during the Soviet era. They were considered autonomous states, yet most of their government policies came from Moscow.

[padillah]

Well, it's got to be at least moderatly useful under some circumstance otherwise why add it?

Tom P.

[Willem]

Originally posted by padillah
Well, it's got to be at least moderatly useful under some circumstance otherwise why add it?

Tom P.

Because you can control other civs with it. Once they become vassals, they have to do what you tell them to. If you tell them to attack your enemy, they will. If you want them to research a particular tech they will, at least so I'm guessing. You can extort money from them, you can tell them not to trade with certain civs etc., etc.. It's going to be a very powerful option in the game if you can get a civ or two to agree to be vassals.

Like I said, if you want to understand how it works, take a look at countries like Poland etc. during the Soviet era. They were all vassal states of the Soviet Union, and even though they showed up on the map as a distinct country, they took their orders directly from Moscow. They had very little leeway to act on their own.

[padillah]

Originally posted by Willem


Because you can control other civs with it. Once they become vassals, they have to do what you tell them to. If you tell them to attack your enemy, they will. If you want them to research a particular tech they will, at least so I'm guessing. You can extort money from them, you can tell them not to trade with certain civs etc., etc.. It's going to be a very powerful option in the game if you can get a civ or two to agree to be vassals.

Like I said, if you want to understand how it works, take a look at countries like Poland etc. during the Soviet era. They were all vassal states of the Soviet Union, and even though they showed up on the map as a distinct country, they took their orders directly from Moscow. They had very little leeway to act on their own.

I understand what a vassal state is but why would anyone agree to it? As far as the game goes it's tantamount to retiring - you loose. If there's no way to get out of it and it doesn't give any bonuses then I'm lost why any AI would agree to it.

As it is, you could be beating them with three or four times the army they have and they won't give you a city for peace. I don't even know why that's an option. To affectivly give you all their cities? (I was tempted to write "all their city", but I didn't)

I understand it's real-world applications and implications. What I don't understand is the game-world applications. It's tantamount to quitting.

Tom P.