Are states' rights more important than human lives?

[Hauldren Collider]

This is idiotic on so many levels...

I give up. Kentonio's a lost cause, like MrFun.

[kentonio]

Did it? Who built all the schools, all the hospitals? Did the state just cobble them out of thin air? Did FDR build them all?

Go read about the wonderful happy safe lives everyone used to live before the evil government started welfare programs.

To save the lives of their little girls and boys.

Maybe you should concentrate on your own life rather than trying to tell other people how to live theirs. Especially when it's a group who spent most of human history being treated like chattel, and have only recently reached a semblance of equality. It tends to make you look a bit of a ***** when you try and turn that clock back.

So I'm as with it as Darwin, Marx and Wilde? Cool.

[kentonio]

I give up. Kentonio's a lost cause, like MrFun.

Oh sweet, the rich kid is here to tell us how the poor don't need healthcare.

[Hauldren Collider]

You're an idiot, kentonio. You don't actually understand the meaning of "cost" and "benefit", which is why you believe that when I suggest we analyze the cost and benefit you think I am trying to **** the poor.

[kentonio]

You're an idiot, kentonio. You don't actually understand the meaning of "cost" and "benefit", which is why you believe that when I suggest we analyze the cost and benefit you think I am trying to **** the poor.

No, I think you're trying to **** the poor, because every political position you've taken in the last year has involved trying to **** the poor.

[Hauldren Collider]

[KrazyHorse]

I presume you're counting emergency room access as healthcare?

That's one element of how wrong the statement was...

[kentonio]

That's one element of how wrong the statement was...

That's fair. I'll reword it to '50m people who's only access to healthcare is a horribly inefficient and expensive source that ends up more expensive than just providing proper healthcare'.

[KrazyHorse]

That's also debatable. Health care pricing, especially by hospitals, is extremely opaque. Cost billed for emergency room visits may or may not have much to do with actual cost to the hospital of providing that service. Mostly this opacity is driven by the the interaction of insurance and government payment rules.

[Krill]

Though providing healthcare in the community is generally cheaper than providing it in hospital settings (ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure etc)

[kentonio]

That's also debatable. Health care pricing, especially by hospitals, is extremely opaque. Cost billed for emergency room visits may or may not have much to do with actual cost to the hospital of providing that service. Mostly this opacity is driven by the the interaction of insurance and government payment rules.

I'm not talking about the direct costs, but rather a) the frequency of severe ailments that could have been cheaply avoided with preventative care and b) the knock on costs related to lost employment etc due to a).

[regexcellent]

Though providing healthcare in the community is generally cheaper than providing it in hospital settings (ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure etc)

I've heard this before, but I don't believe a pound of government prevention is worth an ounce of private sector cure.

[Krill]

*shrug* It doesn't matter if it's government or private sector: getting healthcare when the person first becomes ill is generally cheaper than allowing the illness to progress and potentially requiring a hospital admission. Nor does it really matter what you believe, FWIW.

[Dauphin]

Killing a patient when they first become ill is cheaper still.

[Al B. Sure!]

Killing a patient when they first become ill is cheaper still.

In the zombie apocalypse, we won't be able to take chances.