Social Studies teacher: Don't you dare say bad things about the President!

[Ben Kenobi]

Where did i say that people should be forceds to buy coverage. The fact that a few pennies of coverage for contraceptives bundled in with a comprehensive plan is quite trivial. Take it or leave it.

That's what Obamacare does. I don't have a problem with comprehensive coverage including contraception - so long as I'm not required to buy it. I do have a problem with being forced to buy coverage. Especially if it includes contraception.

[giblets]

I thought that was single payer. Sitting on a list, hoping that you don't die before they get down to you. Seems exactly like lotto.

As for insurance coverage - this is nonsense. You're arguing that the only alternative is insurance coverage that doesn't cover anything, and insurance coverage that covers everything (except for glasses, hearing aids, who needs that!?)

All I want is coverage that covers the things that I need. Glasses, hearing aids, and yes, not having to pay for contraception would be great insurance. I should be able to select from a menu and get the care that I need, and no more or less.

How is coverage for pre-existing conditions like a hearing impairment supposed to work without a mandate requiring everyone to buy it?

[Ben Kenobi]

How is coverage for pre-existing conditions like a hearing impairment supposed to work without a mandate requiring everyone to buy it?

If you're forcing me to buy your contraception, at least give me a reach-around and pay for my hearing aids. I'd wager the cost of my hearing aids is less than your contraception.

[rah]

That's what Obamacare does. I don't have a problem with comprehensive coverage including contraception - so long as I'm not required to buy it. I do have a problem with being forced to buy coverage. Especially if it includes contraception.

I thought you were still babbling about the Christian hospitals being forced to include contraceptive coverage in their health plans. Isn't that a switch for you then?

[Ben Kenobi]

I thought you were still babbling about the Christian hospitals being forced to include contraceptive coverage in their health plans. Isn't that a switch for you then?

My problem has always been with Obamacare forcing Catholics to pay for contraceptive coverage. If people want it, fine, pay for it. Don't force me to pay for it.

[rah]

So having catholic orgs having to include it in their health plans for their employees that want it isn't an issue for you anymore.

[Ben Kenobi]

So having catholic orgs having to include it in their health plans for their employees that want it isn't an issue for you anymore.

Obamacare is forcing them to provide the coverage, just like they do for everyone else. Ergo, one would presume that since I have an issue with forcing people to pay for coverage, that I would also have an issue with forcing Catholic organizations to provide coverage contrary to their mission as Catholic organizations. I've only like stated this 10x and it seems people still don't pay attention.

[rah]

I don't have a problem with comprehensive coverage including contraception - so long as I'm not required to buy it.

So if an employee at a Catholic organization isn't require to buy their health insurance, it's ok if it includes contraceptive coverage.

[Ben Kenobi]

So if an employee at a Catholic organization isn't require to buy their health insurance, it's ok if it includes contraceptive coverage.

I'm fine with an employee of a Catholic organization purchasing their own coverage, even if it includes contraceptive coverage. I'm not ok with a Catholic organization providing contraceptive coverage.

[rah]

I just think it's silly that you want Catholic employees that want the coverage to have to spend literally 50% more for coverage outside the group (or even more if the employer is covering a percentage) than the, at most, a couple more dollars it would cost to have it provided in their employer coverage. Just another case of the Church ignoring reality and pissing off members. They shouldn't complain when people leave the church in droves. Eventually all that will left are the those with dinosaur beliefs like you. At least when I was married in the church, part of MY vows included 'OBEY'. I'm sure you will irritate most women in the room when you use "Die for" instead of "Obey".

[giblets]

There's nothing unequal about demanding that women be submissive servants as long as you insist that you would die for them in the remotely possible circumstances where such would be necessary. Men = warrior caste, women = servant caste. Perfect equality in Benland. Protection in exchange for service sounds like feudalism, which is widely renowned for its egalitarian qualities.

[rah]

I'm sure if I had used the "Die For" vow instead, my wife would have taken me up on it.

[kentonio]

I thought that was single payer. Sitting on a list, hoping that you don't die before they get down to you. Seems exactly like lotto.

Yes, that's exactly what doesn't happen in single payer systems.

[Ben Kenobi]

I just think it's silly that you want Catholic employees that want the coverage to have to spend literally 50% more for coverage outside the group

If they want it, pay for it. Really simple.

(or even more if the employer is covering a percentage) than the, at most, a couple more dollars it would cost to have it provided in their employer coverage.

I think upholding church teachings is worth sacrificing a few dollars.

Just another case of the Church ignoring reality and pissing off members.

Salt and light. If salt loses it's saltiness, you throw it away. The Church has a purpose and undermining church teachings to save a few bucks demostrates that mammon and not God is in charge. And where does it say that the mission of the church is to 'be realistic?' Doesn't Christ himself say that the road is narrow and few choose it, but wide and broad is the road to destruction?

They shouldn't complain when people leave the church in droves.

I'm ok with that. Freedom of association. If people don't want to be part of the Church - then leave. Whining that you can't "have it your way", assumes that the Church is just like Burger King.

Eventually all that will left are the those with dinosaur beliefs like you.

This is a bad thing? This is like saying, your beliefs will go the way of the dinosaurs. FFS, Dinosaurs ruled the earth for over 200 million years. People have managed 1 percent of that, and the Church, 1 percent of 1 percent.

At least when I was married in the church, part of MY vows included 'OBEY'. I'm sure you will irritate most women in the room when you use "Die for" instead of "Obey".

Well, unless we choose to rewrite them - I'm perfectly content to stick with this:

to have and to hold, from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health, until death do you part?

Yeah, I'm sure women are going to be disgusted with this!

[Ben Kenobi]

Yes, that's exactly what doesn't happen in single payer systems.

Happens all the time. Rationing is a *****.