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  • #76
    Originally posted by Elok View Post
    Unions are fading in power and influence over here, and have been for a while. I've read (The Economist, as usual) that it's because unions, formed in an era of massed, low-skill labor, are becoming increasingly irrelevant to a modern specialized workplace. Unquestioning defense of workers made sense back when a worker was just a guy who put two parts on cars all day; now, they tend to shield incompetents, and to favor seniority over talent or work ethic. But that's just what I've read; I've had no firsthand experience with unions myself.
    Sure, the same here - they even start to support other parties/doesn't support parties, but they still deliver vital services such as legal support when there are a legal dispute between a employer and an employee.

    You yanks are a bit funny - you think that it's bad for workers to rally to protect their fellows, but find it just ok that a billion $ company crushes the life of a single worker that can't afford the costs that could give him his rights
    With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.

    Steven Weinberg

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    • #77
      Originally posted by Asher View Post
      I'm not a fan of unions, but damn you set yourself up.
      Well, HC hasn't matured enough to get out of the parental bathroom, so he doesn't know better
      With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.

      Steven Weinberg

      Comment

      • #78
        Originally posted by Hauldren Collider View Post
        Unions are terrible creations of greedy people.


        Perhaps you aren't aware of the appalling working conditions that led to the inevitable rise of the labour movement. It wasn't the near-starving, exploited workers of the 19th century that were greedy. Unions may well have outlived their purpose today, but for those of us whose ancestors toiled in the factories and organised themselves to fight for decent living-standards, they served a valuable and humane role in history.

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        • #79
          If HC was put int an indian sweat shop, he would be dead in a week. He doesn't have a clue about what work is, so of course he doesn't know why unions are relevant.
          With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.

          Steven Weinberg

          Comment

          • #80
            He'll probably be demanding unions in China soon, for the sake of the US manufacturing economy.

            Comment

            • #81
              Why would he care about the US manufacturing economy?

              Comment

              • #82
                Fox Noise has spent the last several months bashing unions because they see unions as helping the other party. In fact, Republicans in general have recently gone on a massive union busting binge even attempting to outlaw unions in whole sectors of the economy. This is no doubt where our impressionable young padawan got his talking point.
                Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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                • #83
                  And he'll support the death penalty for union organizers, because there's no proof that the death penalty doesn't lower cost of operations.
                  "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                  Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

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                  • #84
                    Well, HC do actually have a point - unions would be criminal thughs just as their opponents are, so it could be as asking for doubling the crime rate if unions got power
                    With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion.

                    Steven Weinberg

                    Comment

                    • #85
                      Originally posted by Cort Haus View Post


                      Perhaps you aren't aware of the appalling working conditions that led to the inevitable rise of the labour movement. It wasn't the near-starving, exploited workers of the 19th century that were greedy. Unions may well have outlived their purpose today, but for those of us whose ancestors toiled in the factories and organised themselves to fight for decent living-standards, they served a valuable and humane role in history.
                      1) Everybody's greedy. Applying it as a sobriquet is stupid (I know you are responding to HC's usage)
                      2) Unions only work by ****ing those who are worse off than union members. This is a basic fact that remains true no matter what era in human history we are discussing.
                      12-17-10 Mohamed Bouazizi NEVER FORGET
                      Stadtluft Macht Frei
                      Killing it is the new killing it
                      Ultima Ratio Regum

                      Comment

                      • #86
                        Originally posted by Hauldren Collider View Post
                        Unions are terrible creations of greedy people.
                        We can rely on HC for a simplistic slogan for everything and anything.

                        Comment

                        • #87
                          Originally posted by KrazyHorse View Post
                          1) Everybody's greedy. Applying it as a sobriquet is stupid (I know you are responding to HC's usage)
                          2) Unions only work by ****ing those who are worse off than union members. This is a basic fact that remains true no matter what era in human history we are discussing.
                          As partial proof of (2) it should be noted that the US, where workers are supposedly exploited by their employers has always had a significantly higher fraction of national income accruing to labor than the paradise that is Euroland.
                          12-17-10 Mohamed Bouazizi NEVER FORGET
                          Stadtluft Macht Frei
                          Killing it is the new killing it
                          Ultima Ratio Regum

                          Comment

                          • #88
                            Not everyone is greedy. Everyone is self-interested, but there are a wide range of self-interests that aren't "horde as much to myself as I can".

                            Comment

                            • #89
                              People who aren't greedy are mentally ill. Greed is a survival trait.
                              "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                              Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                              Comment

                              • #90
                                Greed

                                From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
                                For other uses, see Greed (disambiguation).

                                1909 painting The Worship of Mammon by Evelyn De Morgan.



                                Shakespeare Sacrificed: Or the Offering to Avarice by James Gillray.


                                Greed is an excessive desire to possess wealth or goods with the intention to keep it for one's self. Greed is inappropriate expectation. However, greed is applied to a very excessive or rapacious desire and pursuit of wealth, status, and power.
                                As a secular psychological concept, greed is an inordinate desire to acquire or possess more than one needs or deserves, especially with respect to material wealth.
                                [edit] Literature

                                St. Thomas Aquinas wrote that greed was "a sin against God, just as all mortal sins, in as much as man condemns things eternal for the sake of temporal things." In Dante's Purgatory, the avaracious penitents were bound and laid face down on the ground for having concentrated too much on earthly thoughts. ("Avarice" is more of a blanket term that can describe many other examples of greedy behavior. These include disloyalty, deliberate betrayal, or treason, especially for personal gain, for example through bribery.)
                                Ivan Boesky famously defended greed in a May 18, 1986, commencement address at the UC Berkeley's School of Business Administration, in which he said, "Greed is all right, by the way. I want you to know that. I think greed is healthy. You can be greedy and still feel good about yourself".[1] This speech inspired the 1987 film Wall Street, which features the famous line "greed, for lack of a better word, is good".[2]
                                Meher Baba dictated that "Greed is a state of restlessness of the heart, and it consists mainly of craving for power and possessions. Possessions and power are sought for the fulfillment of desires. Man is only partially satisfied in his attempt to have the fulfillment of his desires, and this partial satisfaction fans and increases the flame of craving instead of extinguishing it. Thus greed always finds an endless field of conquest and leaves the man endlessly dissatisfied. The chief expressions of greed are related to the emotional part of man."[3]
                                [edit] Inspirations

                                Scavenging and hoarding of materials or objects, theft and robbery, especially by means of violence, trickery, or manipulation of authority are all actions that may be inspired by greed. Such misdeeds can include simony, where one profits from soliciting goods within the actual confines of a church.
                                [edit] See also


                                [edit] References



                                Categories: Seven deadly sins | Narcissism














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