Going for the snip

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Jon Miller


For something as subjective as enjoyment of sex?

If I cut off one of my ears are you really going to tell me that my enjoyment of music isn't going to be lessened, just because music is so subjective?

[KrazyHorse]

Congratulations, Jon.

You've managed to convince me that infantile circumcision shoud be prohibited except where medically justified.

[Jon Miller]

What would be a common yarstick is that if there was something else enjoyable that was more of a constant (a drug? maybe?) and then have both compare to that. (one who had been cut at birth, and onen who had not)

Jon Miller

[Jon Miller]

It's up to you, I am maintaining my position as I wait for more data.

Jon Miller

[Ben Kenobi]

KH:

Female genital mutilation is done for the sole purpose of depriving the girls of sexual pleasure.

Circumcision is hardly done to deprive the boys of such pleasure. Hence one is mutilation and the other is not.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
KH:

Female genital mutilation is done for the solo purpose of depriving the girls of sexual pleasure.

Circumcision is hardly done to deprive the boys of such pleasure. Hence one is mutilation and the other is not.

Fallacious argument on two counts:

a) Circumcision was often done in the past (during the 20th century, in the Western world) to deprive males of sexual enjoyment (as a curb to masturbation, as was already mentioned)

b) The intent is not what makes something mutilation

[KrazyHorse]

If I cut off all the left hands of youngsters because the devil resides in the left side of the body, then it is just as much mutilation as if I'd cut them off in order to prevent kids from playing the piano.

[Mrs. Tuberski]

Ok Kh and what part of The infant has no consent power whatsoever dont u understand. Just as minors u are bound to what ur parents or guardians choose for you. For female removal u are just as bound but it doesnt stop at the age of 18. What part of the socoety makes it happen even if ur parents dont do it,to females) dont u under stand? that is more barbaric then an adult at the age of 18 deciding to have a circ. I think im speaking english here.

[Ben Kenobi]

a) Circumcision was often done in the past (during the 20th century, in the Western world) to deprive males of sexual enjoyment (as a curb to masturbation, as was already mentioned)

Which has diddly squat to do with why we do circumcision now. The only reason mentioned, and was mentioned several pages ago by the Mrs, is that it helps lazy boys keep their dicks clean. Is that so hard to understand?

b) The intent is not what makes something mutilation

Sure it is. The same act of amputating a limb can be intepreted as mutilation or healing depending on why it is done.

[KrazyHorse]

Tubies

First off, you aren't really speaking English. Your sentences are barely comprehensible.

Secondly, when the hell did I claim that an infant has the power to consent to either circumcision or a clitorectomy? A 10 year-old doesn't have that power either.

Do I have to draw you a ****ing diagram?

Clitorectomies and circumcisions are both procedures which do permanent damage to the individual's enjoyment of sex. They have little to no medical justification in general, though there are obviously individual cases in which they would be of significant benefit to an individual's health. When performed on infants or children there can be no consent given by the individual him or herself, thus the only consent available is parental in nature. If we feel comfortable limiting the ability of parents to consent to clitorectomies then why do we not feel comfortable limiting the ability of parents to consent to circumcision?

Any normal person would have understood that this was my point by now. When you come up with an argument which actually addresses my point then you should feel free to post again.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Sure it is. The same act of amputating a limb can be intepreted as mutilation or healing depending on why it is done.

No, it is not based on intent, but rather actual justification.

In the face of a resounding lack of evidence regarding health benefits, a faith-based assumption that circumcision is medically justified is not sufficient to move circumcision from the realm of mutilation to treatment.

I also note that you've conveniently ignored the number of people in this thread who have stated that they would circumcise their children for conformity's sake.

[KrazyHorse]

I feel sort of bad beating up on two barely-competent debaters like Tuberette and Ben.

See you later, folks. Time to go home

[Asher]

This thread is awesome.

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Asher
This thread is awesome.

ya -- lots of guys like to think with their penises-- This thread is an opportunity to talk about them as well

[Asher]

Be proud of what ya got.