Arnold must decide if killer is executed

[Sava]

Originally posted by Cyclotron


That doesn't make any sense. Most people in prison are not on death row. You've gotten a bit carried away.

It makes perfect sense. Of all the people in prison, it shows that the Death Penalty is being UNFAIRLY APPLIED to WHITE PEOPLE significantly more than any other ethnic group.

Of course, that is assuming that race is actually a factor in how the Death Penalty is applied.

Personally, I don't believe it is.

[Sava]

Originally posted by MOBIUS

Bit like how he boasts about the Bears D when the best offensive they've beaten is ranked an anaemic 18th...

Maybe those teams are ranked so low BECAUSE THEY ARE PLAYING DA BEARS!!!

[Cyclotron]

Originally posted by Sava
It makes perfect sense. Of all the people in prison, it shows that the Death Penalty is being UNFAIRLY APPLIED to WHITE PEOPLE significantly more than any other ethnic group.

No, it doesn't. People go to prison for numerous offenses, most of which are not capital. The amount of people in prison for burglary, drug offenses, rape, and non-capital murder have nothing to do with the fairness or racial biasing of the death penalty. The argument you are making is simply a sham.

[Sava]

Originally posted by MOBIUS

If we were to look at the proportion of blacks that get the DP in relation to the TOTAL POPULATION of the US -

That's a good point. Because you would see that the number of blacks receiving the Death Penalty, proportionally is less than the number of blacks incarcerated in general.

So if the stats are to be believed, THE JUSTICE SYSTEM IN GENERAL IS RACIST.

So in terms of racism, the Death Penalty would be less racist than the Justice System in general.

[Sava]

Originally posted by Cyclotron


No, it doesn't. People go to prison for numerous offenses, most of which are not capital. The amount of people in prison for burglary, drug offenses, rape, and non-capital murder have nothing to do with the fairness or racial biasing of the death penalty. The argument you are making is simply a sham.

So you are saying white people commit murder more often than black people?

RACIST!

[Sava]

I love it when I PWN people and they just can't accept it.

[Cyclotron]

Originally posted by Sava
So you are saying white people commit murder more often than black people?

RACIST!

No. Relatively few murders are capital crimes.

[Sava]

Originally posted by Cyclotron


No. Relatively few murders are capital crimes.

So the government chooses to pursue the Death Penalty then much more for WHITE PEOPLE!!!

RACISM!!!

[Ted Striker]

Originally posted by Sava


So the government chooses to pursue the Death Penalty then much more for WHITE PEOPLE!!!

RACISM!!!

Do we have to quote the 80% of death penalty reviews are for racial minorities again? Or the Philly study?

You can hit the autoreply button over and over with those two unrelated stats again but find me some reputable studies that have actually analyzed the data to verify your claim.

Until you do, it's pretty much meaningless.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Winston
The criteria of being 'eligible for the death penalty' fails to address mitigating or aggravating circumstances raised during the penalty phase of individual cases.

Having been found guilty of killing a person with premeditation, in some states killing numerous persons with premeditation, will make you eligible for the death penalty, but that status says nothing about the specific circumstances leading up to the sentencing.

Which makes summaries of death sentences based on race - or whether you wear glasses, a toupé or drink whole milk - a meaningless piece of statistic.

No, it doesn't make it meaningless. It means that there is further disaggregation to do. Which is what other studies have attempted to do, and they see a clear bias remaining. Most particularly regarding the race of the victim (race of the offender plays a role, but smaller).

Waving your hands and saying that the numbers are meaningless is the "see no evil" technique, and is, quite frankly, lazy.

[Sava]

Oh... I was wrong... in 2002 and 2003, 44 WHITE PEOPLE were executed in the US... 20 blacks. 65 total people.

So 67.7% of the people executed in the US in 2002 and 2003 were WHITE.

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/cp03.pdf

[Cyclotron]

Originally posted by Sava
So the government chooses to pursue the Death Penalty then much more for WHITE PEOPLE!!!

RACISM!!!

You can make either of two claims:

- The Justice system is racist
- The Death Penalty is racist

If you believe the former, then you must look at all crimes generally. If you look at the latter, you must look at only death penalty cases. In neither circumstance can you compare Death Row with the general prison population. It doesn't make any sense.

The best way to analyze the racial nature of the death penalty would be to look at all people accused of capital crimes who were found innocent, and all people convicted of crimes but not given the death penalty (when the death penalty was pursued), and then all people convicted and sentenced to death. Then, you would look at what the conviction rates were, respectively, for blacks and whites. Looking at the death row population alone is a poor way to support a theory of racial bias.

[Ted Striker]

Originally posted by Sava
Oh... I was wrong... in 2002 and 2003, 44 WHITE PEOPLE were executed in the US... 20 blacks. 65 total people.

So 67.7% of the people executed in the US in 2002 and 2003 were WHITE.

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/cp03.pdf

White people
------------------------------------------
44 executions / 235,990,895 people = 1.86

Black People
-------------------------------------------

20 executions / 37,521,497 people = 5.33


You do the math

[MOBIUS]

Originally posted by Sava
That's a good point. Because you would see that the number of blacks receiving the Death Penalty, proportionally is less than the number of blacks incarcerated in general.

That's not the point I'm making and you know it, you coward...

So if the stats are to be believed, THE JUSTICE SYSTEM IN GENERAL IS RACIST.

So in terms of racism, the Death Penalty would be less racist than the Justice System in general.

No, the DP is racist - the justice system in general is more racist...

Do you seriously expect people to fall for your crap!?

[Sava]

Originally posted by Cyclotron


You can make either of two claims:

- The Justice system is racist
- The Death Penalty is racist

If you believe the former, then you must look at all crimes generally. If you look at the latter, you must look at only death penalty cases. In neither circumstance can you compare Death Row with the general prison population. It doesn't make any sense.

The best way to analyze the racial nature of the death penalty would be to look at all people accused of capital crimes who were found innocent, and all people convicted of crimes but not given the death penalty (when the death penalty was pursued), and then all people convicted and sentenced to death. Then, you would look at what the conviction rates were, respectively, for blacks and whites. Looking at the death row population alone is a poor way to support a theory of racial bias.

But see... that's my whole point.

THE SYSTEM IS NOT RACIST ONE WAY OR ANOTHER.

Each case is different. Each case has evidence and each case is handled by the system based upon the merits of that evidence. RACE DOES NOT PLAY INTO IT.

Sure, there are probably racist cops out there, maybe a racist judge or racist prosecutor. But this isn't the South circa 1920's. This isn't the time of Jim Crow.

Cases are won and lost on the basis of the evidence, the competency of the lawyers, and many other factors. We're not in the time where some racist cop is going to railroad a guy and get in front of a racist judge and then just sentence a guy to death.

The whole argument of "the Death Penalty is racist" IS COMPLETE BULL****!!!

If you are against the death penalty on moral grounds. Fine. I can respect that.

But this racism argument is bogus. I've proven it.

Only these bull**** studies done by people who distort the facts, misinterpret statistics, and have an agenda to push say otherwise. And they don't hold water to the statistics when you look at them.