Eight Thousand Years of Civilization ...gone

[Keygen]

Originally posted by Tuomerehu

In my opinion, this is nothing compared to the atrocity committed by Taleban in March, 2001.

Nothing.

I don't think that making comparisons on disasters that have to do with items of archeological value is adequate.
But if you must do a comparison is a budda of gigantic proporsions more valueable than around 170.000 ancient items that where stolen or destroyed in the fore mentioned museum?

[Bereta_Eder]

and of course those who got them can sell them at "nice" prices to artifact collectors and have quite a sum of money...

[Keygen]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
[Q] Originally posted by Jon Miller

Too loot the place for stuff to sell. It's worth a lot of money.

If they do sell them after all.
At list the one or the other way they would sooner or later return to the scientific community through other museums, galleries or private collections.
What I am afraid more is that most of them will not be sold but rather been used for other purposes...

[Keygen]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

All of you who think Baghdad is such a safe place might want to review what happened in Umm Qasr. I don't want US soldiers taking any foolish risks until we are sure that all the irregular forces in Baghdad are neutralized...

Go home then...

[CerberusIV]

What annoys me about this is that a breakdown of law and order could have been predicted. There could have been an effort to deal with the situation through curfews or prohibited areas or limiting movement around the city (like keeping some of the bridges closed) and there wasn't.

The likelihood is that some of this material was stolen to order by criminal gangs and will end up on the international black market for historical artefacts. It will be lost to archaeology, at least temporarily. Some of the pieces will end up in the hands of american collectors, some of whom got the money to buy these items through the oil business. I don't believe that was a deliberate intention but it will happen and it stinks. The USA just stood back and allowed criminal enterprise to flourish (again).

If there are any significant museums in Syria or Iran now might be a good time to start worrying about their collections.

[Az]

If they do sell them after all.
At list the one or the other way they would sooner or later return to the scientific community through other museums, galleries or private collections.
What I am afraid more is that most of them will not be sold but rather been used for other purposes...

look at my ancient babylonian ornamental vase turned kitchen pot!

[Keygen]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

You've done nothing to show that America is at fault for the museum's looting; all the cliche pronouncements in the world won't change that.

The museum was looted because Baghdad had no authority left to prevent the masses from pillaging everything they could which was caused by the sudden and by force overwhelming of the Iraqi regime by the British-American invasion in the city. So Americans - and British - have something to do with the looting after all. Can't blame the Iraqi's or the Americans alone but all together whether you like it or not.

These accusations, right or wrong is the result of a frustrated world public opinion which condemn the war even if this results to the remove of a despicable dictator like Saddam.

[Keygen]

Originally posted by Jon Miller

I still don't see anyone adressing the main point

why should the US have expected the IRaquesse to loot (And vandalise) their own museums?

Common, even in b-class movies of mass destruction you can see looting taking place

[SpencerH]

They're Iraqi artifacts aren't they? They've just moved from the hands of a small number of curators back into the hands of the Iraqi people. Seems like social justice to me.

[Harovan]

Originally posted by SpencerH
They're Iraqi artifacts aren't they? They've just moved from the hands of a small number of curators back into the hands of the Iraqi people. Seems like social justice to me.

If you are serious about this, I pity you. The hands of some criminal looters are not the hands of the Iraqi people.

[gunkulator]

Assuming that Iraq stabilizes and gets a better gov't than what it had, I say we postpone all this bellyaching for now and ten years later ask the Iraqis this question:

Would you rather:

a) Have lived under Saddam's enlightened dictatorship for the last 10 years - with the added bonus of knowing that the artifacts were safe in the museum.

or

b) Enjoy the freedoms you have now but, sorry, the artifacts are in some fat cat's personal collection.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by SpencerH
They're Iraqi artifacts aren't they? They've just moved from the hands of a small number of curators back into the hands of the Iraqi people. Seems like social justice to me.

More precisely, they have moved from a museum where they were displayed to the general public and available for archeological research to small number of thugs who'll sell them to rich people from around the world.
I wouldn't call that "social justcie" but I am an idiot

[SpencerH]

Thugs? Enterprising Iraqi folk who see an opportunity to re-distribute the wealth, thugs? Are you sure you're a eurocomm?

[Keygen]

Originally posted by yavoon

honestly I think the museum is a tragedy too. but what I see is everyone jumping like rabid wombats onto its carcass in an attempt to smeer the US as much as humanly possible. and I feel a desire to defend against that.

I can't know for sure but I have the feeling that everyone that have blamed the US directly or indirectly meant the US administration and specifically the part that planned and supported the war in Iraq.

[Spiffor]

Gunkulator :
You are doing exactly what must I find disgracious. You are minimizing the loss simply because you are in favor of the war. I find it disgraceous too when anti-war people only use this catastrophe to bash the US.

Instead of mourning the huge loss humanity has known, this thread has become a place where flag waving opposes US bashing, and the incident becomes secundary.

This thread deserves its one star