Persecution of christians

[MrFun]

We know that Babylon as a city existed in the early ancient era -- do we know the exact years that the city emerged??

4001 BC -- no, it's 4002 BC -- no wait, it's . . . .

ah somewhere between 4500 BC and 4000 BC.

[Berzerker]

We know that Babylon as a city existed in the early ancient era -- do we know the exact years that the city emerged??

4001 BC -- no, it's 4002 BC -- no wait, it's . . . .

ah somewhere between 4500 BC and 4000 BC.

If that date is right, would it be accurate to say the historical event of the founding of Babylon was 10,000 BC?

[Ben Kenobi]

Is having Christmas-break instead of Ramadan-break persecuting Moslems?

No one's stopping them from practicing. Do Muslims in Muslim countries stop working during the entire month of Ramadan?

As for Christmas break, in the world of PC, it is the 'Winter' holiday.

Berz: Sorry about the last post. I'm a little acerbic today.

[Ben Kenobi]

Berz:

Stop picking on Mr. Fun. That's not fair.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Secondly, what part of the nativity scene strikes you as particularly ahistorical? I believe that it is an accurate historical account.

For one thing, it is mentioned only in one of the three Synoptic Gospels. Historically, there was no census taken around that time, and certainly most of the "hiotorical events" in the Synoptic Gospels are not.

[Berzerker]

Ben - I noticed, no problem. A little acerbic for you is down right polite around here.

[Berzerker]

Stop picking on Mr. Fun. That's not fair.

Just having some "fun" , but he should try to convince people Jesus existed instead of calling them morons. I believe Jesus existed but I fall far short of being able to prove it...

[Lung]

You Americans are crazy

If people didn't go out of their way to disrupt other people's lives, these issues wouldn't arise. Hey, i don't believe any of it, but even from a purely cultural perspective, the nativity scene is important, and shouldn't be offensive to anyone. It's interesting to note that the complaints come from people of christian backgrounds.

Whingers are the bane of human society!!!

[Vesayen]

Well they ARE right... The events of Chanuka for example are documented historically in dozens of places, those friendly to Jews and those not, the accounts are all pretty similar-the events unquestionably all happened

In any case I still think this is rediculous, this is some jack ### abusing the letter of a law to lash out at Christians.

[St Leo]

Uhm, can you really compare a nativity scene with a menorah? I'd understand comparing a four-pointed star with a menorah, but a nativity scene goes far above and beyond a token symbol.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by MrFun
That some morons have claimed that Jesus Christ was not born at all -- that he never existed as a person.

Hey, look who's sounding like a fundamentalist himself. Along with your snotty "supergenius" comment, I'm wondering when you became so shrill.

As Jack and Berz pointed out, and you ignored, there are sound reasons for doubting an historical Jesus, and even better ones for doubting the reality of the Nativity. We've had several discussions of this in the past.

There is, in fact, NO contemporary evidence of the existence of Jesus, and there's a lot of circumstantial evidence that indicates he didn't exist as described in the Bible at all. Is it conclusive? No, and likely never will be, but it's certainly not the domain of "morons." Perhaps you'd like to remove your head from your derriere in this matter and understand that different people have drawn different conclusions from the evidence.

Now, I'd like you to prove to me Jesus really existed. Keep in mind that only first-hand, documentary evidence contemporary with his life is accepted as conclusive. Go.




(btw, the NYC schools are, as usual, being stupid)

[Dr Strangelove]

Wouldn't having a Ramadan break be kinda like having off all of Lent? That's a little ambitious don't you think?

It seems to me to that the people who established this policy are incredibly bad tacticians if what they had in mind was further reducing religious influences in the public school system. What do they think they're going to accomplish by favoring a total of about 5% of the population (Muslems and Jews) over the other 75%? Wouldn't that sorta be like Denmark staging a pre-emptive attack against Germany in 1940? They're forcing a conflict over a minor side issue. Oh wait, the public schools are already very much secularized, so there really isn't an issue currently. Howevwer, on the day that there is an issue, supposing that someone wants to re-instate prayer, they will have utterly scuttled what ever amount of rational perspective the general public might have had on the issue.

The guy who came up with this idea should be sent to Iraq....to plan strategy and tactics for the opposition. We'd soon be knee deep in captive suicide bombers.

[Ben Kenobi]

For one thing, it is mentioned only in one of the three Synoptic Gospels.

So do all the Synoptic Gospels have to repeat each other?

Historically, there was no census taken around that time, and certainly most of the "hiotorical events" in the Synoptic Gospels are not.

Well I think it 's high time somebody posted the account.

Luke 2:1-20

"In those days Caesar Augustus issued a decree that a census should be taken of the entire Roman world. (This was the first census that took place while Quirinius was governor of Syria.) And everyone went to his own town to register.

So Joseph also went up from the town of Nazareth in Galilee to Judea, to Bethlehem the town of David, because he belonged to the house and line of David. He went there to register with Mary, who was pledged to be married to him and was expecting a child. While they were there, the time came for the baby to be born, and she gave birth to her firstborn, a son. She wrapped him in cloths and placed him in a manger, because there was no room for them in the inn.

The Shepherds and the Angels

And there were shepherds living out in the fields nearby, keeping watch over their flocks at night. An angel of the Lord appeared to them, and the glory of the Lord shone around them, and they were terrified. But the angel said to them, "Do not be afraid. I bring you good news of great joy that will be for all the people. Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is Christ[1] the Lord. This will be a sign to you: You will find a baby wrapped in cloths and lying in a manger."

Suddenly a great company of the heavenly host appeared with the angel, praising God and saying,

"Glory to God in the highest,
and on earth peace to men on whom his favor rests."

When the angels had left them and gone into heaven, the shepherds said to one another, "Let's go to Bethlehem and see this thing that has happened, which the Lord has told us about."

So they hurried off and found Mary and Joseph, and the baby, who was lying in the manger. When they had seen him, they spread the word concerning what had been told them about this child, and all who heard it were amazed at what the shepherds said to them. But Mary treasured up all these things and pondered them in her heart. The shepherds returned, glorifying and praising God for all the things they had heard and seen, which were just as they had been told.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov


Hey, look who's sounding like a fundamentalist himself. Along with your snotty "supergenius" comment, I'm wondering when you became so shrill.

As Jack and Berz pointed out, and you ignored, there are sound reasons for doubting an historical Jesus, and even better ones for doubting the reality of the Nativity. We've had several discussions of this in the past.

There is, in fact, NO contemporary evidence of the existence of Jesus, and there's a lot of circumstantial evidence that indicates he didn't exist as described in the Bible at all. Is it conclusive? No, and likely never will be, but it's certainly not the domain of "morons." Perhaps you'd like to remove your head from your derriere in this matter and understand that different people have drawn different conclusions from the evidence.

Now, I'd like you to prove to me Jesus really existed. Keep in mind that only first-hand, documentary evidence contemporary with his life is accepted as conclusive. Go.




(btw, the NYC schools are, as usual, being stupid)

So you brush off archaeological evidence as "circumstantial?"

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by MrFun
So you brush off archaeological evidence as "circumstantial?"

Show me some. When has there been any archealogical evidence for Jesus's existence? Keep in mind the recent box of James was proven a fraud, and any mention of Ken Hovind will be laughed at.

Where's this archeological evidence?