Indisputable Abortion FACTS:

[Zylka]

Originally posted by Asuka


W00t! Someone must have changed the evolution...

* Asuka goes off to read Origin of Species by Charles Darwin.

You might want to look into a rather all inclusive concept known as "sprituality", in regards to what I said - smartass

Originally posted by Asuka

I agree with Sava

That says plenty. Next!

[Zylka]

Originally posted by Asuka

And please use more well written English in order to make your message abit more clear.

Oh my. I guess we're not done here, then.

[Rasbelin]

Still up and kicking, Zylka? I would have thought Prozac or Zyprexa would have taken care of you... Ack, life can be hard.

[Zylka]

Why would you say something like that? Is it your inability to respond to or defend your ironically atrocious grammar - or do you honestly hold people who take medications of lower esteem?

[Zylka]

Here it is again, in case you're still confused:

Originally posted by Asuka

And please use more well written English in order to make your message abit more clear.

Originally posted by Asuka

And please use more well written English in order to make your message abit more clear.

That's almost signature material, friend! Please don't change one bit...

[Rasbelin]

No, but people who have drugged themselves aren't always on the clear side with all things going on. However I can't of course be sure you are drugged *right now*, but you can make a such assumption.

Plus the grammar comment was targeted to yavoon, not you. Sorry to disappoint you by not giving you more reasons to argue.

[Rasbelin]

@ post http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...12#post2239612

Zylka, I suggest staying on-topic and not making such a big fuss about one sentence.

[Zylka]

Ok, that's fair. Yet in case you missed it, I'll again point out the glaring defeat you brought upon yourself:

Originally posted by Asuka

And please use more well written English in order to make your message abit more clear.

Would you like it from another angle - or does the incompetent structure and irony make even you laugh, yet?

[Rasbelin]

Yes, I did get the point. You don't have to fill my screen with those damn letters.

[Zylka]

Well then don't dismiss someone as being drugged beyond ability after they've responded to your smart ass methods with a similar approach. Sorry you have to go through being intellectually beaten up by a manic/depressive on a gaming site - it happens to even the best of us!

[Spiffor]

Of course, Z, you didn't even take notice of Asuka's points. It's much better to argue on one mere sentence irrelevant to the debate.

But I guess that's cool for you if you think you can wan arguments this way. This reminds me of Berzerker, who convinces himself he wins about every argument he takes on Poly

[Zylka]

But I guess that's cool for you if you think you can wan arguments this way. This reminds me of Berzerker, who convinces himself he wins about every argument he takes on Poly

I don't feel the need to wan arguments when my opponent hasn't the ability to even put them forth coherently

[Spiffor]

@ pro choicers:

Have you noticed that every "debate" between us and the backwards camp has the same ring to it:

1. The only big argument of theirs is that "abortion is murder". No matter what, any anti-choicer will always want to approach abortion from the foetus (happy now Z?) perspective. The only references to mothers are talking about 'responsability of their actions'. They are also extremely dismissive as to what will happen to the unwanted child after birth, as well as to its other innocent family members.

There is a reason for that. Abortion objectively alleviates the suffering that everybody involved in an unwanted pregnancy will experience: mother, father, siblings, and the unwanted kid itself, you name it...

You'll notice there was only one anti-choicer in this thread (CyberShy) who did argue over the benefits abortion brings to people. You'll also notice his only argument on the matter was "unwanted children will continued to be loved". He did not adress the major economic and social impact an unwanted kid can have on your life and others. He dismissed parents badly raising their unwanted children as "0,5%".
Some people even dismissed the whole economic distress which an unwanted pregnancy can create as "inconvenience" (Yavoon). You'll also notice nearly no anti-choicer seems to think about the unwanted kid's future and suffering. Some way to "think of the children"
In other threads, someone gives a great deal of importance to the suffering of women. Or rather one kind of women's suffering: the post abortion psychologic trauma (Obiwan).

This leads me to believe the anti-choice crowd is hypocritically using human suffering as an ideological tool when needed, and dismisses or overlooks it when it goes against their little hoiler-than-thou values.

Debates about post-birth suffering are avoided by the anti-choice crowd because IT DESTROYS THEIR WHOLE ARGUMENT. That's why they'll stick with saying "abortion is murder".

2. We are stupid enough to enter their little games. They successfully shift the focus from what abortion is really about (preventing whole lifes of being ruined) to their pet issue, that is whether destroying foetuses is murder or not.

And in these kind of arguments, we sure look silly. Soem will argue foetuses aren't human at all, some will argue foetuses aren't living, some will argue foetuses are expandable etc.
Basically, taking part into these "debate" can only make us look like stupid people who can't understand what a foetus is, or like heartless baby killers.
Worse, taking part into this debate further puts the focus on embryoes, and even further away from born people.
It can only desserve our cause, because our cause is right only when you think of the real and constatable suffering abortion could have prevented. It can not be right if you forget why this difficult and painful practice has been introduced.

Mates, let's change the focus from the embryo to born people now ! Let's turn this sorry troll-thread into a thread which discusses the real issues behind abortion !

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Atahualpa
From what you have wrote I think you have acted wrong in that you have suggested a certain way to go. I think everyone here has a valid point. I think you would have to bring all these points into a discussion, but not to confuse the woman, instead stabilize her so that she can make a choice as a rational fully aware human and you'd have to live with whatever her choice was.

Well, I was ome kind of advisor for a few months at that time, and my main advice so far had been consistently for her to take the pill. However, her problem was that she was unable to have a rational understanding of her fecundity - a trait she has taken from her mother, grandmother and great-grandmother who were equally fecked up and who gave young birth to plethora of fatherless kids.
That's why she didn't manage to take the pill even when she tried to. That's why she wasn't able to walk in the drug-dealer's shop to ask for a morning-over pill.
She knew very well a second baby would turn her really difficult situation into an outright impossible one. Heck, to convince her to abort, I merely had to repeat what she had told me over the months. She knew rationality dictated her to abort. She just wasn't able to listen to rationality.

While I still feel good for having done the right thing, I still feel sad when I'm thinking about her tears, when she understood that I was right (she knew it all along, I was saying her arguments) and that she'd have to kill once again her foetus. I'd have prefereed contraception method by far, cause abortion is most often a terrible yet necessary remedy

At least, she has learned at last. She now takes the pill, and seems to be much less fecked up about pregnancy (this may come back in the future though, as it happened to her mother). I sure prefer it that way

[Rasbelin]

Originally posted by Spiffor
Mates, let's change the focus from the embryo to born people now ! Let's turn this sorry troll-thread into a thread which discusses the real issues behind abortion !

Are you trying to make us look like a group of feminists that take to the barricades and chant "GIRL POWER!"?