NFL - Are You Ready For Some Football?! - Off Season

[Ben Kenobi]

Yes because we all know the one thing Doug Flutie does. All he does is win Super Bowls

Because his career was about as valuable as the player that they spent a first round pick on? Think they could have used that pick on someone else? Why would you throw away someone that was such good value?

[-Jrabbit]

I'm enjoying Ben's attempt to blame the Bears for Flutie's career failure. I especially like the implication that no one would "give him a fair chance," but when he got the chance (after his pro experience in the USFL), the Bears were somehow "throwing him to the wolves."

Then he tries make it a referendum on Bears management because the team has never had a statistically dominant QB in the modern era. Why? Gotta move the goalposts, I guess.

They should. They haven't won a SB since.

At least they've been there. Has Flutie? Oh, gee, no. Never even won a playoff game in the NFL.
His shot with the Bears is actually the closest he ever came.

I will say this: Inch for inch, Doug Flutie was certainly the shortest professional QB of his era.

[Ben Kenobi]

Then he tries make it a referendum on Bears management because the team has never had a statistically dominant QB in the modern era. Why? Gotta move the goalposts, I guess.

You don't feel that their overall QB development issues had an impact on Flutie's development?

[-Jrabbit]

Not in Chicago. He was brought in mid-season, when the team was busy playing actual football games and competing for a second Super Bowl. The Bears gave him his first taste of NFL action, which ultimately probably helped his development much more than manning a clipboard would have.

[rah]

My issue was his lack of leadership. At least in Chicago. I guess when he finally got to Canada, having actually played in a real league probably helped his credibility.
I expect a QB to earn the respect of his teammates. Jim McMahon wasn't the best numbers QB but inspired the offense to help with the ONLY MEANINGFUL stat, WINS.
Flutie's was as short on leadership skills in Chicago as his stature. And if I remember correctly, Da Coach liked Flutie.

[Ben Kenobi]

Flutie was 8-5 before going to Canada. That's quite a bit better than most QBs over the start of their career.

[Al B. Sure!]

Flutie was 8-5 before going to Canada. That's quite a bit better than most QBs over the start of their career.

No he was not 8-5 as a starter. Where do you even get this stuff from? He was 9-6.

And some of his wins had nothing to do with him.

3 straight weeks in 1988:
21-10 win vs. MIA, Flutie went 7/14 for 74 yards 1 TD 1 INT
14-13 win vs. NYJ, Flutie went 6/20 for 78 yards 1 TD 2 INT
6-3 win vs. MIA, Flutie went 9/13 for 78 yards 0 TD 0 INT

2 weeks later after losing to the Colts:
13-7 win vs. SEA, Flutie went 5/10 for 47 yards 0 TD 1 INT

Those were 4 of Flutie's wins and in them, he averaged 69 yards, half a TD, and one INT per game! How the hell is a starting QB putting up those terrible numbers week in and week out and winning?!


Doug Flutie was WORSE than his record indicates. Except in San Diego, Doug Flutie was ALWAYS surrounded by talent!

The 1988 Patriots, the NE team which Flutie got the most starts with, were the league's #5 defense and #9 rushing team.

[Al B. Sure!]

Let's get all the facts together, ranking the teams by yardage allowed/yardage gained:

Flutie played for the 1986 Bears, the league's #1 defense and #1 rushing attack. But hey, that was only two starts. How about the teams that he actually started at least 4 games for:

1988 Patriots, the league's #5 defense and #9 rushing attack. (6-3 as starter)
1998 Bills,#6 defense and #3 rushing attack. (7-3)
1999 Bills, #1 defense and #8 rushing attack. (10-5)
2000 Bills, #3 defense and #13 rushing attack. (4-1)
2001 Chargers, #11 defense and #20 rushing attack. (5-11)
2003 Chargers, #27 defense and #6 rushing attack. (2-3)

How often do you see such a QB BLESSED by a top defense AND top running game virtually every year? But AS SOON as he got to teams that weren't in the top-10 in defense and rushing, look at how the losses started to pile up

Doug Flutie wasn't given a fair chance?!

Doug Flutie was BLESSED by circumstance!!!!! Fate smiled all over Doug Flutie but he will be best remembered for a drop-kick!

[Al B. Sure!]

I'm done. There's no more data I can pull up except analyzing gamelogs one-by-one and recreating games.

I've analyzed Flutie's individual statistics to death, analyzed his team compositions and the quality and performances of his team-mates around him and on the defense, analyzed individual games of note, gave a full narrative of his career with the Bills gleaned from statistics and game analysis...

I have nothing else to bring to the table. There is nothing else. I will never be able to look at Doug Flutie the same way again. If, before a few months ago, you mentioned Doug Flutie, I would have been like, "Who? The short guy who did the drop-kick?". Now, Doug Flutie has whole new meaning to me.

He was not a good QB. His stats indicate he was fundamentally average. A guy with a proclivity to heave the ball deep, completion percentage and sustaining an offense be damned. He was quick on his feet too but not much of a runner in terms of gaining yardage; he was pretty great at avoiding sacks, though, with one of the best sack percentages in the league, actually; all the more surprising because of his tendency to avoid the check-down. His 'prime' years occurred in an inferior league so there's no way to be sure where Doug Flutie stood but his performance at both the beginning and the end of his career was fundamentally average. He was, however, surrounded by elite talent until his San Diego days when he suddenly looked far worse than he had been previously. That advantage of talent around him likely inflated his own statistics and especially inflated his winning percentage.

That is Doug Flutie. An average QB blessed by circumstance who performed average-ly.

But there's nothing else to say.

I'm completely Flutied-out.

Ben can go pour himself another bowl of Flutie Flakes and keep being just that... A Flutie Flake




Oh and Doug Flutie is Lebanese. That's cool, I guess, for me.

[Ben Kenobi]

Those were 4 of Flutie's wins and in them, he averaged 69 yards, half a TD, and one INT per game! How the hell is a starting QB putting up those terrible numbers week in and week out and winning?!

He was a winner everywhere he went. 9-6 is pretty good for a rookie.

[Ben Kenobi]

But AS SOON as he got to teams that weren't in the top-10 in defense and rushing, look at how the losses started to pile up

Uh, 2000 Chargers won one game. With Flutie they were +4. That was a horrible team.

[Ben Kenobi]

His 'prime' years occurred in an inferior league so there's no way to be sure where Doug Flutie stood but his performance at both the beginning and the end of his career was fundamentally average.

Statistically, he was well above the league average at the age of 37. That speaks volumes as to his overall career.

[Al B. Sure!]

Yeah Ben is definitely a Christian. His faith in the Flutie speaks volumes about his faith in general.

[-Jrabbit]

It really doesn't. All you have is supposition and rose-colored glasses, Ben. I see little to suggest he would have been special in the NFL. Hell, he might have been squashed like a bug by Charles Martin.

If that hadn't happened to McMahon, he might still be awaiting his first chance.

[Ben Kenobi]

If that hadn't happened to McMahon, he might still be awaiting his first chance.

If they had kept Flutie they could have been a dynasty.