FF09 IDP League Draft

[Ben Kenobi]

I think LT was fine, Rivers was early

Well it was a choice between RB2 and one of the top tier QBs. I had Rivers, Brees, Manning and Brady on my list at the top. Brees Manning and Brady all went before, so that left me Rivers, or going down a notch. I wasn't impressed by depth at the TE position in a 14 man league, so I wanted to grab Gates. I didn't expect Colston to fall to me, so that meant I put off RB2 again to grab one of the best WRs out there. Then Jackson/Ward gave me some really good WRs.

I'm happy with everything except that RB2 slot, but I still have options at this point and they should be still available.

[snoopy369]

His BAPAY is John Carlson TE-SEA, by the way.

[Ben Kenobi]

but you have to win once you're there, and it doesn't help there since nobody has bye weeks at 14+.

Idea is that all my starters play 13 weeks with one off. I stack up all the byes on the same week and leave the other 13 weeks with a full squad.

As for the playoffs, the Chargers have Cincy at home, at Tennessee and home against the Redskins. The only one that's really challenging is the Titans away game but this is an eternity away!

[snoopy369]

Well it was a choice between RB2 and one of the top tier QBs. I had Rivers, Brees, Manning and Brady on my list at the top. Brees Manning and Brady all went before, so that left me Rivers, or going down a notch. I wasn't impressed by depth at the TE position in a 14 man league, so I wanted to grab Gates. I didn't expect Colston to fall to me, so that meant I put off RB2 again to grab one of the best WRs out there. Then Jackson/Ward gave me some really good WRs.

I'm happy with everything except that RB2 slot, but I still have options at this point and they should be still available.

I certainly think you have a decent team; again, the point is more that you could've done better. Rivers is not in the Manning/Brees/Brady group; he's good, but he's not that good. He's in the second notch, even if near the top of that notch, and picking him meant you got a slight upgrade versus a huge upgrade at RB2/WR1. I see Rivers and Rodgers as nearly identical (along with Romo), and I think I reached slightly to take Rodgers - I'd certainly have taken any of the intervening three (Westy, Moss, or AJ) instead if I could have.

Same with Gates - you could've had Gonzales or at least Dallas Clark 28 picks later, perhaps a slight drop in quality for a huge draft position drop. Fantasy Football is a game of marginal gains; getting slightly better at a certain spot means the difference between winning and losing at the end of the day.

Don't forget that part of drafting is guessing others' opinions - even if you think Rivers is better than Romo/Rodgers, not too many other people have him ahead of them. Many even have Warner ahead of him, after all. And even if he's better than all of them, you're not in the right spot to draft him; the 17th pick is too early for a QB that will score maybe 5% more than the guy you get at 40, and maybe 15% more than the guy you get at 68. Sometimes you have to realize when you simply are out of position to get a guy you like. If you had Andre Johnson now instead of Rivers, and swapped Gates with a QB (whomever was available at that point, possibly one of Romo/Rivers/Rodgers, or else Mcnabb/Cutler/Palmer), you'd be better off by quite a bit at this point.

This team:
McNabb
Andre Johnson
Marques Colston
LT
Willie Parker (or another RB available at 6.12, or even keep Vincent Jackson again for RB/WR)
Dallas Clark

is better than yours by a bit, and that's assuming the worst case - that you couldn't get Rivers at 3.12, for example, which may not be true [I take Rodgers anyway, and who knows about Romo], and even assumes you can't get Romo or Rodgers instead of Rivers; and the same for Gates-TE, it assumes you can't get Tony G instead of Clark.

[Berzerker]

damn, I'm not paying enough attention. This league has 3 weeks of playoffs and I've been thinking just 15-16

[Zopperoni]

It's still weeks 15 and 16, if you're very optimistic about your chances

[-Jrabbit]

[Ben Kenobi]

He's in the second notch, even if near the top of that notch, and picking him meant you got a slight upgrade versus a huge upgrade at RB2/WR1

Well I like your strategy and took it into serious consideration at the time. I would have sooner dropped the Rivers pick then the Gates pick. When I saw my original draft slots I had a much different team listed because as you said, I was out of position for Rivers and LT. I figured LT would go about 8th or so, and that Rivers would go at the start of the third. I basically saw it this way, 1 top pick, 3 folks all about the middle (Rivers/Gates/VJax).

My hope was to get Brees at 12, and then go Gore to start off followed by Gates and then Addai.

[snoopy369]

I think you overvalue TE a lot, but in general your problem looks more like it's a common novice problem - you went in targeting particular players. That's how you end up picking out of position [like I nearly did last round, wanting Sproles, but I eventually convinced myself that Sproles is not an acceptable pick when good picks like Stewart were still out]. You decide you won't be able to get a guy in 28 picks or whatever, and reach for him, where you could've otherwise gotten a better player.

[SlowwHand]

Why are all of you talking here? Wasn't there a thread set up for that? You've absolutely polluted this thread.
And who is "Visanthe Shiancoe (BAPAY)"? That's kind of sloppy. I hate to say it, but it is. Sloppy, sloppy, sloppy.

[Ben Kenobi]

I think you overvalue TE a lot

Maybe so. We'll see. I wanted the bestest TE ever, and I made sure I got him at his ADP, around 40.

you went in targeting particular players. That's how you end up picking out of position [like I nearly did last round, wanting Sproles, but I eventually convinced myself that Sproles is not an acceptable pick when good picks like Stewart were still out]. You decide you won't be able to get a guy in 28 picks or whatever, and reach for him, where you could've otherwise gotten a better player.

Well as I said I have a chart, and told myself I'd make one exception to the chart and pick them ahead of their slot, and that was Rivers. To me there is quite a gap between Romo and Rodgers and Rivers. Everyone else has been lower then their slotted position.

[Ben Kenobi]

1.1 SlowwHand - Adrian Peterson - RB - MIN
1.2 EPW - Maurice Jones-Drew-RB-JAX
1.3 duke o' york - Michael Turner RB ATL (BAPAY)
1.4 Guynemer - Matt Forte RB CHI (list)
1.5 -Jrabbit - Steven Jackson RB STL
1.6 Deity Dude - Tom Brady QB NE
1.7 spaced cowboy - DeAngelo Williams RB CAR (BAPAY)
1.8 snoopy369 - Chris Johnson RB TEN (instructions)
1.9 Zopperoni - Drew Brees QB NO
1.10 Berzerker - Peyton Manning QB IND
1.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Steve Slaton RB HOU
1.12 Ben Kenobi - LaDainian Tomlinson RB SD
1.13 Jaguar - Frank Gore RB SF
1.14 Tuberski -Clinton Portis RB WAS

2.14 Tuberski - Larry Fitzgerald WR ARI
2.13 Jaguar - Brandon Jacobs RB NYG
2.12 Ben Kenobi - Philip Rivers QB SD
2.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Brian Westbrook RB PHI
2.10 Berzerker - Randy Moss WR NE
2.9 Zopperoni - Andre Johnson WR HOU
2.8 snoopy369 - Aaron Rodgers QB GB
2.7 spaced cowboy - Marion Barber - RB DAL
2.6 Deity Dude - Kevin Smith - RB DET
2.5 Jrabbit - Calvin Johnson WR DET
2.4 Guynemer - Greg Jennings WR GB
2.3 duke o' york - Steve Smith WR CAR (BAPAY -- fixed)
2.2 EPW -Reggie Wayne WR Ind
2.1 SlowwHand - Pierre Thomas RB NO

3.1 Slowwhand - Roddy White WR ATL
3.2 EPW -Ronnie Brown RB Mia
3.3 Duke o' York - Marshawn Lynch RB BUF (BAPAY)
3.4 Guynemer - Thomas Jones RB NYJ
3.5 Jrabbit - Ryan Grant RB GB
3.6 Deity Dude - Reggie Bush - RB - NO
3.7 spaced cowboy - Tony Romo - QB - DAL
3.8 snoopy369 - Knowshon Moreno - RB - DEN
3.9 Zopperoni - Darren McFadden RB OAK
3.10 Berzerker - Anquan Boldin WR AZ
3.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Wes Welker WR NE
3.12 Ben Kenobi - Antonio Gates TE SD
3.13 Jaguar - Donovan McNabb QB PHI
3.14 Tuberski - Larry Johnson RB KC

4.14 Tuberski - Roy Williams WR DAL
4.13 Jaguar - Julius Jones RB SEA
4.12 Ben Kenobi - Marques Colston WR NO
4.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Kurt Warner QB ARI
4.10 Berzerker - Jason Witten TE DAL
4.09 Zopperoni - Derrick Ward RB TB
4.08 Snoopy369 - Terrell Owens WR BUF
4.7 spaced cowboy - Chad Ochocinco WR CIN
4.6 Deity Dude - Joseph Addai - RB - Indy
4.5 Jrabbit - Jay Cutler QB CHI
4.4 Guynemer - Antonio Bryant WR TB
4.3 duke o' york - Matt Cassel QB KC (BAPAY)
4.2 EPW - Matt Schaub QB HOU (per instructions)
4.1 SlowwHand - Carson Palmer QB CIN

5.1 Slowwhand - T.J. Houshmandzadeh WR SEA
5.2 EPW - Dwayne Bowe WR KC (per instructions)
5.3 Duke o' York - Tony Gonzalez TE ATL (BAPAY)
5.4 Guynemer - Matt Ryan QB ATL
5.5 Jrabbit - Brandon Marshall WR DEN
5.6 Deity Dude - Donald Driver WR GB (BAPAY CHANGE)
5.7 spaced cowboy - Chris Wells RB ARI (from PM list)
5.8 snoopy369 - Jonathan Stewart RB CAR
5.9 Zopperoni - Braylon Edwards WR CLE
5.10 Berzerker - Leon Washington RB NYJ (bapay change)
5.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Anthony Gonzalez WR IND
5.12 Ben Kenobi - Hines Ward - WR PIT
5.13 Jaguar - Santana Moss WR WAS
5.14 Tuberski - Eli Manning QB NYG

6.14 Tuberski - Dallas Clark TE IND
6.13 Jaguar - Santonio Holmes WR PIT
6.12 Ben Kenobi - Vincent Jackson WR SD
6.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Eddie Royal WR DEN
6.10 Berzerker - Felix Jones RB DAL
6.09 Zopperoni - Ray Rice RB BAL
6.08 Snoopy369 - Jerricho Cotchery WR NYJ
6.7 spaced cowboy - Lance Moore WR NO (BAPAY)
6.6 Deity Dude - Bernard Berrian WR MIN (BAPAY)
6.5 Jrabbit - Greg Olsen TE CHI
6.4 Guynemer - Derrick Mason WR BAL
6.3 duke o' york - Kevin Walter WR HOU (BAPAY)
6.2 EPW - Owen Daniels TE Hou
6.1 SlowwHand - Chris Cooley TE WAS

7.1 SlowwHand - Rashard Mendenhall RB PIT
7.2 EPW - LenDale White RB TEN
7.3 duke o' york - Willie Parker RB PIT (smart Bapay)
7.4 Guynemer - Darren Sproles RB SD
7.5 Jrabbit - Josh Wilson DB SEA
7.6 Deity Dude - Visanthe Shiancoe MIN (BAPAY)
7.7 spaced cowboy - John Carlson TE SEA (BAPAY)
7.8 snoopy369 - Steve Breaston (WR-ARI).
7.9 Zopperoni -
7.10 Berzerker -
7.11 Koyaanisqatsi -
7.12 Ben Kenobi -
7.13 Jaguar -
7.14 Tuberski -

[Ben Kenobi]

Zopp, you are up.

[Zopperoni]

1.1 SlowwHand - Adrian Peterson - RB - MIN
1.2 EPW - Maurice Jones-Drew-RB-JAX
1.3 duke o' york - Michael Turner RB ATL (BAPAY)
1.4 Guynemer - Matt Forte RB CHI (list)
1.5 -Jrabbit - Steven Jackson RB STL
1.6 Deity Dude - Tom Brady QB NE
1.7 spaced cowboy - DeAngelo Williams RB CAR (BAPAY)
1.8 snoopy369 - Chris Johnson RB TEN (instructions)
1.9 Zopperoni - Drew Brees QB NO
1.10 Berzerker - Peyton Manning QB IND
1.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Steve Slaton RB HOU
1.12 Ben Kenobi - LaDainian Tomlinson RB SD
1.13 Jaguar - Frank Gore RB SF
1.14 Tuberski -Clinton Portis RB WAS

2.14 Tuberski - Larry Fitzgerald WR ARI
2.13 Jaguar - Brandon Jacobs RB NYG
2.12 Ben Kenobi - Philip Rivers QB SD
2.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Brian Westbrook RB PHI
2.10 Berzerker - Randy Moss WR NE
2.9 Zopperoni - Andre Johnson WR HOU
2.8 snoopy369 - Aaron Rodgers QB GB
2.7 spaced cowboy - Marion Barber - RB DAL
2.6 Deity Dude - Kevin Smith - RB DET
2.5 Jrabbit - Calvin Johnson WR DET
2.4 Guynemer - Greg Jennings WR GB
2.3 duke o' york - Steve Smith WR CAR (BAPAY -- fixed)
2.2 EPW -Reggie Wayne WR Ind
2.1 SlowwHand - Pierre Thomas RB NO

3.1 Slowwhand - Roddy White WR ATL
3.2 EPW -Ronnie Brown RB Mia
3.3 Duke o' York - Marshawn Lynch RB BUF (BAPAY)
3.4 Guynemer - Thomas Jones RB NYJ
3.5 Jrabbit - Ryan Grant RB GB
3.6 Deity Dude - Reggie Bush - RB - NO
3.7 spaced cowboy - Tony Romo - QB - DAL
3.8 snoopy369 - Knowshon Moreno - RB - DEN
3.9 Zopperoni - Darren McFadden RB OAK
3.10 Berzerker - Anquan Boldin WR AZ
3.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Wes Welker WR NE
3.12 Ben Kenobi - Antonio Gates TE SD
3.13 Jaguar - Donovan McNabb QB PHI
3.14 Tuberski - Larry Johnson RB KC

4.14 Tuberski - Roy Williams WR DAL
4.13 Jaguar - Julius Jones RB SEA
4.12 Ben Kenobi - Marques Colston WR NO
4.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Kurt Warner QB ARI
4.10 Berzerker - Jason Witten TE DAL
4.09 Zopperoni - Derrick Ward RB TB
4.08 Snoopy369 - Terrell Owens WR BUF
4.7 spaced cowboy - Chad Ochocinco WR CIN
4.6 Deity Dude - Joseph Addai - RB - Indy
4.5 Jrabbit - Jay Cutler QB CHI
4.4 Guynemer - Antonio Bryant WR TB
4.3 duke o' york - Matt Cassel QB KC (BAPAY)
4.2 EPW - Matt Schaub QB HOU (per instructions)
4.1 SlowwHand - Carson Palmer QB CIN

5.1 Slowwhand - T.J. Houshmandzadeh WR SEA
5.2 EPW - Dwayne Bowe WR KC (per instructions)
5.3 Duke o' York - Tony Gonzalez TE ATL (BAPAY)
5.4 Guynemer - Matt Ryan QB ATL
5.5 Jrabbit - Brandon Marshall WR DEN
5.6 Deity Dude - Donald Driver WR GB (BAPAY CHANGE)
5.7 spaced cowboy - Chris Wells RB ARI (from PM list)
5.8 snoopy369 - Jonathan Stewart RB CAR
5.9 Zopperoni - Braylon Edwards WR CLE
5.10 Berzerker - Leon Washington RB NYJ (bapay change)
5.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Anthony Gonzalez WR IND
5.12 Ben Kenobi - Hines Ward - WR PIT
5.13 Jaguar - Santana Moss WR WAS
5.14 Tuberski - Eli Manning QB NYG

6.14 Tuberski - Dallas Clark TE IND
6.13 Jaguar - Santonio Holmes WR PIT
6.12 Ben Kenobi - Vincent Jackson WR SD
6.11 Koyaanisqatsi - Eddie Royal WR DEN
6.10 Berzerker - Felix Jones RB DAL
6.09 Zopperoni - Ray Rice RB BAL
6.08 Snoopy369 - Jerricho Cotchery WR NYJ
6.7 spaced cowboy - Lance Moore WR NO (BAPAY)
6.6 Deity Dude - Bernard Berrian WR MIN (BAPAY)
6.5 Jrabbit - Greg Olsen TE CHI
6.4 Guynemer - Derrick Mason WR BAL
6.3 duke o' york - Kevin Walter WR HOU (BAPAY)
6.2 EPW - Owen Daniels TE Hou
6.1 SlowwHand - Chris Cooley TE WAS

7.1 SlowwHand - Rashard Mendenhall RB PIT
7.2 EPW - LenDale White RB TEN
7.3 duke o' york - Willie Parker RB PIT (smart Bapay)
7.4 Guynemer - Darren Sproles RB SD
7.5 Jrabbit - Josh Wilson DB SEA
7.6 Deity Dude - Visanthe Shiancoe TE MIN (BAPAY)
7.7 spaced cowboy - John Carlson TE SEA (BAPAY)
7.8 snoopy369 - Steve Breaston WR ARI (PM)
7.9 Zopperoni - DeSean Jackson WR PHI
7.10 Berzerker -
7.11 Koyaanisqatsi -
7.12 Ben Kenobi -
7.13 Jaguar -
7.14 Tuberski -

PM to Berz

[Jaguar]

BK's strategy is actually very sound, and I'll laugh and laugh when he beats a whole bunch of you guys.