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Prediction Thread: When Will Ukraine Conquer Russia

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  • Originally posted by Bereta_Eder View Post
    Historical memory helps avoid tragedies

    it is not a burden
    Oh yes...we should never forget, Those lessons were to hard and should never be forgotten. I believe that is the attitude of Germany's government and people as well. Holding a grudge and judging people by a past they have rejected is both unfair and counterproductive. I did not say "forgive and forget". I said reconciliation and finding common ground based in shared values is the key.

    But we do agree that those times and their horror should never be forgotten.
    "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

    Comment


    • My great grand uncle blew up a bridge PLATO

      it killed a hundred germans and a full load of armor and weapons

      the nazis/germasns got him and tortured him to death

      but before he died they released him and got him back to his mother to watch him die

      My name is not the same as his, but my grandma always was saying that I am as tall and as proud as my great uncle that the gestapo tortuted to death becasue he was defending his family

      I will hold on to my views

      Comment


      • During the American Civil War the Union army burned my Great-Great Grandfather's house, murdered him in front of his wife, raped her and his daughter, beat my teenage Great Grandfather, and stole everything of value they had. (For the record...they were NOT slaveholders...just Farmers. They had no involvement in the war) Do I look at everyone from the Northern U.S. in a vile light? Of course not. Was it a horror that should never be repeated? Of course it shouldn't. My family has never forgotten, but we are all part of the same country. I do not hold it against people what their ancestors did. I judge the person before me for who they are. That is moving on. Maybe it is just to early...maybe that horror was to close in time. I know my Grandfather never said "Yankee" without putting the word "Da mn" in front of it. History teaches us harsh lessons, but it is up to us what we do with them. I can say this...I truly do sympathize with the loss your family experienced. The challenge for the following generations is to ensure it does not happen again. To ultimately make sure of that we must find common ground. That doesn't mean to forget or forgive...it just means looking for a better future for all.
        "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

        Comment


        • I respect beyond words that you shared that story with me.
          You know we only know what hollywood tells us, and that is a very different story.

          I bow my head and have nothing to say to what you told me


          I only ask for a bit lenience because I will say this:
          you were the same country. We were invaded by a foreign country

          But I do hear what you say

          Comment


          • And we did have our own civil war here as well

            actually the history of the US and Greece has many MANY common aspects

            many of the most fervent philellines, friends of Greece were americans in the 1800s

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Bereta_Eder View Post
              And we did have our own civil war here as well

              actually the history of the US and Greece has many MANY common aspects

              many of the most fervent philellines, friends of Greece were americans in the 1800s
              I have nothing but great respect and fondness for Greeks. Amazing people and an amazing country. I had the opportunity many years ago to work for a second generation Greek family owned business. They were some of the kindest people and best business persons I have ever worked for. The Church they attended (Greek Orthodox of course!) had a festival every year where there was some incredible food. They always brought some to the office so that all could share in it. I am pretty "American" in my food taste, but the food was wonderful beyond compare! They went back to Greece every other year and always came back with pictures and stories. Fantastic people and representatives of Greece.
              "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Bereta_Eder View Post

                fine line....

                all the germans were nazis
                You call Sophie Scholl and her brother a Nazi?
                Tamsin (Lost Girl): "I am the Harbinger of Death. I arrive on winds of blessed air. Air that you no longer deserve."
                Tamsin (Lost Girl): "He has fallen in battle and I must take him to the Einherjar in Valhalla"

                Comment


                • Haha that's great

                  My contact with americans was with a guy from delaware - we wanted the same italian girl - he won - he wanted her more

                  with a guy we played pool from texas

                  and the most sweet grils from pensylvania out on a trip of europe

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Bereta_Eder View Post
                    I respect beyond words that you shared that story with me.
                    You know we only know what hollywood tells us, and that is a very different story.

                    I bow my head and have nothing to say to what you told me


                    I only ask for a bit lenience because I will say this:
                    you were the same country. We were invaded by a foreign country

                    But I do hear what you say
                    Never shared that with Poly before. I have to say that being raised in the South in the 1960s had a very...let's say tainted...point of view. People sharing detailed knowledge here on Poly brought a lot of clarity and change to many things I grew up being told were fact but actually were distortions. It made me realize that we cannot take all "facts" at face value. We must look deeper into things for ourselves. Tragedy happens and horrors are part of the human condition. It is how we face the future while armed with the knowledge of the past that makes us advance as a people. I will never forgive what was done to my family, but I will look to the future. I will judge people on how they are now...not how their parents or grandparents...or great great grandparents were. I will look for truth and not believe the masses. I will seek what is and what motivations are. I will stand for a brighter future in a world where aggressors are confronted and realize that people can change.

                    I like you BE. You seem to be an honest person who stands by their beliefs. That is a rarity in this world.
                    "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

                    Comment


                    • Anyway...back to Ukraine and Russia:

                      Is Boris Johnson full of it or is Putin an idiot?

                      Boris Johnson says he had an "extraordinary" call with President Putin before the Ukraine invasion.

                      "I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration somehow you're not patriotic. We should stand up and say we are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration." - Hillary Clinton, 2003

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by PLATO View Post

                        25 Million German dead during WW II probably culled most of them, don't you think?
                        25 million number might be much too high. Most estimates for ll war related German deaths from the war range from 4 to 6 million.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by PLATO View Post


                          I like you BE. You seem to be an honest person who stands by their beliefs. That is a rarity in this world.
                          Some other people seem to share your opinion and trusted me with a huge load of repsonsibility at my work

                          there is a girl I'm going to share that burden with and sh'e very hot which compicates things

                          Comment


                          • I've always had a very simplistic, partisan view of the war of Southern secession. I regarded the side that declared in all of the written instruments and declarations of secession that the threat to slavery was the first justification for fighting to secede had to be the "bad guys". Plato's posts remind me that even if, after the fact, we can clearly see that the aims of one side of a conflict were more objectionable than the other, there is never a limit to how much evil can be found on any side of a war.

                            The US was lucky that a kind of unity was eventually returned to a deeply divided population decades after the guns went silent. The hatred and resentment was slow to cool because the trauma could never really heal, only recede into the past.

                            If Ukraine was in some places ambivalent about unity with Russia before Feb 2022, Russia has probably managed to replace such ambivalence with hatred of Russia and love of Ukraine nearly everywhere they occupied in Ukraine last year. I don't think hatred will dissipate until this entire generation and their children and grandchildren and every family member who heard the accounts first hand has finally passed away.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Proteus_MST View Post

                              You call Sophie Scholl and her brother a Nazi?
                              On the average german I have nothing but friendly feelings


                              on the german state is another matter

                              Comment


                              • Really I will not watch a german and say NAZI! lol no on the very very contrary



                                but I wll judge the german external policy
                                not only me believe me

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