Who do you tip to win the US presidential election

[Serb]

A bloody motherf*cking suckers!

[Kidlicious]

If they do an audit and don't get the result you want you'll say the audit was fraudulent.

Enron should have tried this excuse.

[Serb]

The Hitler himself have been inspired by your conquest of the Wild West, but failed!
Because he has faced Soviet people, not Native Americans!

But, you f*ckers never learn from the failures of him!

[pchang]

Three of those Presidents are a total disgrace.

The total disgrace is that this is the President and the type of "Freedumb" you support. Lancer, Slow, Dinner, .... care to comment?

[Kidlicious]

Why are we doing all these audits of states Biden won and not doing audits of the states that Trump won? Like North Carolina, Texas and Florida?

And obviously the assumption has to be that the election wasn't fraudulent, otherwise no election could ever take place (the audit the audit to prove it wasn't fraudulent, audit the audit of the audit to prove it wasn't fraudulent, and so on). Audits are reasonable, within a reasonable time window (which is almost closed), if reasonable. Like evidence of fraud (not accusations) or a narrow victory. It is possible to also do one if there is a large discrepancy between polls/votes or the like, but that isn't something we as society have agreed on (and would cause Texas, Florida, Montana, Maine, etc to be audited... which is probably not reasonable).

JM

Polls mean nothing. You do an audit when there is evidence of fraud, including circumstantial evidence.

Saying that an audit is reasonable misses the point, because audits aren't being done.

So if audits aren't being done when they should be done, and there is evidence of fraud then the election can not be certified. Certifying that would itself be fraud.

[-Jrabbit]

There is literally no example of actual fraud in any of Trump's current efforts to overturn election results.

Some dude claiming he did some math is evidence of nothing. Well, it's evidence of Trump's intense degree of desperation.

This is clearly Trump attempting a coup against the legitimate, duly elected government and against the obvious, landslide will of the American voting public. As any patriot would agree.

WHY DO YOU HATE DEMOCRACY, KID?

[Kidlicious]

There is literally no example of actual fraud in any of Trump's current efforts to overturn election results.

Some dude claiming he did some math is evidence of nothing. Well, it's evidence of Trump's intense degree of desperation.

This is clearly Trump attempting a coup against the legitimate, duly elected government and against the obvious, landslide will of the American voting public. As any patriot would agree.

WHY DO YOU HATE DEMOCRACY, KID?

The people that refuse to do an audit talk about democracy

[Kidlicious]

The statistical evidence will be judged in court so .....

[Kidlicious]

I mean it's hilarious. People that respect democracy do audits to make sure elections are legit.

[Jon Miller]

Saying that an audit is reasonable misses the point, because audits aren't being done.

So if audits aren't being done when they should be done, and there is evidence of fraud then the election can not be certified. Certifying that would itself be fraud.

Many audits have been done. None have turned up evidence of fraud.

Many recounts have been done, none have changed the result.

Many accusations of fraud have been made, none with evidence that stood up in the court of law. Or, arguably, none with evidence period.

Invalidating votes based on an accusation without evidence is a complete and total attack on democracy. If it goes through, we would not live in a democracy anymore.

Even invalidating a massive amount of votes based on limited evidence, without proof of the impact or that the votes should be invalidated, would be an outrageous attack on democracy and invalidate our democracy.

Either would result in general strikes and possibly civil war.

There is no way to have a democracy in such a situation. There are all sorts of leftists with accusations (Without evidence generally) of fraud in elections in all sorts of Republican states. If all of the states/districts where there is an accusation without proof of a change of result from an audit/etc were invalidated, there would be approximately 0 counted votes for president and no possibility of elections.

I do not understand why you think that the left would allow rightwing loonies to do stuff that we don't allow leftwing loonies to do. And we are very concerned that many on the right seem to be going along with it right now (although not all).

JM

[Jon Miller]

If your response is 'might makes right' and 'Trump is the president so we have the might', then that isn't a democracy.

JM

[Kidlicious]

Many audits have been done. None have turned up evidence of fraud.

Many recounts have been done, none have changed the result.

Many accusations of fraud have been made, none with evidence that stood up in the court of law. Or, arguably, none with evidence period.

Invalidating votes based on an accusation without evidence is a complete and total attack on democracy. If it goes through, we would not live in a democracy anymore.

Even invalidating a massive amount of votes based on limited evidence, without proof of the impact or that the votes should be invalidated, would be an outrageous attack on democracy and invalidate our democracy.

Either would result in general strikes and possibly civil war.

There is no way to have a democracy in such a situation. There are all sorts of leftists with accusations (Without evidence generally) of fraud in elections in all sorts of Republican states. If all of the states/districts where there is an accusation without proof of a change of result from an audit/etc were invalidated, there would be approximately 0 counted votes for president and no possibility of elections.

I do not understand why you think that the left would allow rightwing loonies to do stuff that we don't allow leftwing loonies to do. And we are very concerned that many on the right seem to be going along with it right now (although not all).

JM

You are blatantly lying. No audits have been performed. No audits are even planned. We may get an audit in MI.

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/526818-michigan-election-official-leaning-towards-audit-delay-in-vote

Beyond that it doesn't look like we will get any audits. Why? Because people guilty of fraud don't allow audits whenever they have the power to stop them. But then of course you get a fraudulent election and an illegitimate President. Not good, especially when you like to accuse people of being against democracy.

And you have no evidence of fraud by Trump. If you did you would be calling for audits. That line of argument is false.

[Kidlicious]

If your response is 'might makes right' and 'Trump is the president so we have the might', then that isn't a democracy.

JM

If that were so he could force audits. He can't even do that.

But this is in the hands of people like you. Will you people allow this fraud or not? But see the media has you all confused. You think people are against democracy. Well guess what,, people are. Those people are just yourselves.

[BeBMan]

US election 2020: Biden certified Georgia winner after hand recount

US President-elect Joe Biden's narrow victory in Georgia has been officially certified by Republican Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger.

It comes as legal efforts by Donald Trump's allies to challenge his defeat were dismissed in three other states.

The Democrat beat his Republican rival in Georgia by 12,284 votes, according to the audit required by state law.

Mr Raffensperger on Friday said he was disappointed that his party lost but that "numbers don't lie".

Mr Biden is set to take office in January as the 46th US president.

Mr Biden's victory margin in the public vote overall stands at more than 5.9 million. His victory in the US Electoral College system, which determines who becomes president, is projected to be 306 to 232 - far above the 270 he needs to win.

(...)

full: https://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2020-55006188

[Jon Miller]

Audits and recounts are similar although I know in some cases they may be different.

Recounts have happened/are happening in (hand!) Georgia and Wisconsin (only Democratic majority countries in Wisconsin?).

So you are wrong, as you have continually been, about no audits/recounts happening.

JM