Elon Musk

[Giancarlo]

Yep. I serve the public to the best of my ability.

[Dinner]

Tesla is burning through $1B per quarter and was reported to have reserves of $2.7B. Also reported that Tesla is asking for refunds from suppliers. Could be big trouble.

They did burn a lot of cash with that paying for two production lines, finding out neither worked, then replacing them with three new production lines fiasco. That will not be an on going expense but it was a waste of a lot of money. They probably will need to raose capital in 2019 but theor balance sheet will be much better by then

as for "asking for money back" that claim has mostly been shown to not be true. They supposedly float an idea about jointly buying credit default swaps with suppliers for thos quarter goong forward to help midigate risks such as materials price swings (think Trump's tariffs) and some how bears claimed that was demanding money back. There is a lot of disinformation out there right now.

[Dinner]

Dinner, I am a union member and without unions workers would have no recourse and no ability to improve conditions. And the business insider article I posted is not a hit piece.

Antiunion attitudes have left this country in the ****ter as far as benefits and wages. I'd like to see these workers negotiate their own salary and benefits. Yeah right. When union were stronger the gap between CEO pay and employee pay isn't what it is now.

Tesla is operated by a republican sleaze bag who benefits from tax breaks given by a democratic administration and assembly in Sacramento. He doesn't treat his workers correctly and there have been countless stories where workers simply collapse from exhaustion.

I had lots of recourse by simply telling my old employer "Here are three other job offers which have been given to me so I want a 20% raise and a better work schedule or I am leaving." He only offered 10% and no change in work schedule so I left. My commute is down by 2 hours per day, my current schedule is mostly fixed, and I mainly work on just one prevailing wage job site on a contract which will run at least another 1.5 years if not longer. I think that is a pretty good recourse.

The new employer also gives me more paid time off, gives us free drinks and snacks, plus has cattered lunches every Friday. Last week was Shabu-Shabu and today is Italian.

[Aeson]

I miss drinksnacks, he was fun!

[Dinner]

You should stop believing nonsense from Speakeasy. I am still fun and still am a great guy with lots of friends.

[Giancarlo]

That's great you can negotiate things, but most employers in this country aren't like that and most people don't have multiple job offers. I have worked union and nonunion and always have had better benefits and way better pay in unionized work. This is my own personal anecdote however.

So rather than just free drinks and snacks, I get higher pay and better healthcare benefits. I can use the better pay for my kombucha habit because I know an employer would just bring soft drinks lol. Plus I also have life insurance, accident insurance (in case I get injured and can't work) and PPO dental (way better than HMO dental).

Btw I have a plethora of discounts via my union. Even basic movie tickets are 40-50% off. I guess those minimal union fees paid off in other ways.

[rah]

I get all those things and more, and I don't have to pay any fees. I have averaged 33% or better increases every time I've changed jobs. But I will concede that like Dinner, I am not your average worker. A few companies ago, I was sent to what was billed as a team building offsite seminar. Upon arrival I discovered it was a Union Busting Workshop. Boy was that illegal. It was an enjoyable week only because it ended up being a team building exercise when all of us were going WTF.

[Giancarlo]

I get all those things and more, and I don't have to pay any fees. I have averaged 33% or better increases every time I've changed jobs. But I will concede that like Dinner, I am not your average worker. A few companies ago, I was sent to what was billed as a team building offsite seminar. Upon arrival I discovered it was a Union Busting Workshop. Boy was that illegal. It was an enjoyable week only because it ended up being a team building exercise when all of us were going WTF.

I get paid way more than comparable nonunion jobs and as I said the fees are minimal, compared with the contrasting incomes.

[Dinner]

The unemployment rate in San Diego is 2.9% and falling. Any competent professional should be able to beat the bushes and get multiple offers. We have jobs for soil techs which pay $65 per hour at my company and we can't find qualified workers even though they just need a high school diploma, a nuke gauge license ($45 and one 8 hour class), and a bit of science understanding.

I don't buy the claim that people can't find work and well paid work at that.

[Giancarlo]

The unemployment rate in San Diego is 2.9% and falling. Any competent professional should be able to beat the bushes and get multiple offers. We have jobs for soil techs which pay $65 per hour at my company and we can't find qualified workers even though they just need a high school diploma, a nuke gauge license ($45 and one 8 hour class), and a bit of science understanding.

I don't buy the claim that people can't find work and well paid work at that.

That proves nothing.

Yeah if you know someone. and not everyone is going to be a tech. Most people aren't working in those jobs. Stop degrading and attacking unions. The decline of unions is why wages have been stagnant for decades.

And what do you not buy? The average person doesn't make $65 an hour.

This has nothing to do with what I said. Most people would be happy with even $20 an hour. And that is insufficient to even afford an apartment these days. And you sit here and claim these six figure jobs are easy as pie to get. Not buying it.

[Dinner]

That's great you can negotiate things, but most employers in this country aren't like that and most people don't have multiple job offers. I have worked union and nonunion and always have had better benefits and way better pay in unionized work. This is my own personal anecdote however.

So rather than just free drinks and snacks, I get higher pay and better healthcare benefits. I can use the better pay for my kombucha habit because I know an employer would just bring soft drinks lol. Plus I also have life insurance, accident insurance (in case I get injured and can't work) and PPO dental (way better than HMO dental).

Btw I have a plethora of discounts via my union. Even basic movie tickets are 40-50% off. I guess those minimal union fees paid off in other ways.

I have health, dental, vision, life insurance, disability insurance, a medical savings plan, a full match on 3% of pay for my 401k, and other stuff I probably don't remember. I declined the health insurance as I already have VA for free and they agreed to give me $200 a month extra for declining health insurance. It isn't much but an extra $2400 a year is better than nothing.

[Giancarlo]

I have health, dental, vision, life insurance, disability insurance, a medical savings plan, a full match on 3% of pay for my 401k, and other stuff I probably don't remember. I declined the health insurance as I already have VA for free and they agreed to give me $200 a month extra for declining health insurance. It isn't much but an extra $2400 a year is better than nothing.

Most nonunion employees are lucky to get anything from their employer and have to inquire about state provided healthcare.

I get it all too and far higher wages than comparable nonunion jobs. What is the issue here? You really hate unions that much?

[Dinner]

Discount movie tickets are nice. My employer is giving everyone two to four free Padres tickets next month plus they rented a corporate box with cattering and an open bar.

I bank at Navy Federal Credit Union and they offer perks like a free yearly Costco membership. Those are little things but I like Perks and it does save money. No union involved (except at the government funded construction site I inspect but I am not a member yet am still covered by the labor agreement).

[Giancarlo]

Discount movie tickets are nice. My employer is giving everyone two to four free Padres tickets next month plus they rented a corporate box with cattering and an open bar.

I bank at Navy Federal Credit Union and they offer perks like a free yearly Costco membership. Those are little things but I like Perks and it does save money. No union involved (except at the government funded construction site I inspect but I am not a member yet am still covered by the labor agreement).

Oh please.

Not everybody is you and the average person is lucky to even see anything free from their employer beyond free coffee.

No union? You would be happy if unions didn't exist? Again, let me go over this for you... With unions, I make perhaps 35-40% more than I would in a comparable nonunion job. And I'm saying comparable in terms of responsibility and duties.

And the fees are minimal. I do elect to give a few more dollars in a completely separate COPE fund for the union, but that is solely for political matters and unrelated to my union fees.

[Dinner]

That proves nothing.

Yeah if you know someone. and not everyone is going to be a tech. Most people aren't working in those jobs. Stop degrading and attacking unions. The decline of unions is why wages have been stagnant for decades.

And what do you not buy? The average person doesn't make $65 an hour.

This has nothing to do with what I said. Most people would be happy with even $20 an hour. And that is insufficient to even afford an apartment these days. And you sit here and claim these six figure jobs are easy as pie to get. Not buying it.

I am more senior so I get paid more than that. I am not a tech, I am an inspector. I manage techs. Many unions, like the UAW, have simply been corrupt at the top and unresponsive to workers thus why people leave. As for unionized government workers, that is just horrible as there is not alternative to going to the DMV, and like FDR I am against unions in government and would seek to outlaw them.

Though it is possible I might change my mind if I eventually get a government job. Here in California just this week we had a case of a woman who works for the DMV sleeping 4 hours per day at her desk for four years and she still has her job. We had another who spent two months at home remodeling his house yet filling out time cards and getting paid as if he showed up for work. Yeah, there needs to be way fewer protections for government workers because not being able to fire such dirt bags is absurd.

[Dinner]

Most nonunion employees are lucky to get anything from their employer and have to inquire about state provided healthcare.

I get it all too and far higher wages than comparable nonunion jobs. What is the issue here? You really hate unions that much?

Most employees should get themselves a marketable in demand skill then leverage the crap out of that to get themselves the highest wages possible. That is what I do and it works. No unions or union fees involved.

You do have to be more proactive though I think the extra effort is worth it.

[Giancarlo]

I am more senior so I get paid more than that. I am not a tech, I am an inspector. I manage techs. Many unions, like the UAW, have simply been corrupt at the top and unresponsive to workers thus why people leave. As for unionized government workers, that is just horrible as there is not alternative to going to the DMV, and like FDR I am against unions in government and would seek to outlaw them.

You have some vile views and I have nothing further to say to you. You are lashing out at unions for the service at the DMV? I don't believe DMV employees are even unionized (not sure on this one).

You have seriously and severely misguided views about government workers and unions.

Most people in my workplace take pride in the work they do, have better pay and better benefits. When people are happy they tend to do better at work.

You are lashing out at me personally because you don't like the fact I'm unionized and better paid? That's nice.

Edit: I will not make this personal.