Pope sends direct message to Ben

[Imran Siddiqui]

@ the Anglicans surpassed the Catholics in heresy hunting and Martin Luther executed people (oh, and completely forgetting about the Vatican states) - I almost forgot about the power the Catholic Church held in excommunicating princes and kings !

[DinoDoc]

Is there a meaningful difference between Anglican and Catholic Doctrine?

[Ben Kenobi]

Is there a meaningful difference between Anglican and Catholic Doctrine?

Right now? Anglicans believe in female priests, abortion, contraception, gay marriage, and have the queen as their head. Some of them reject transubstantiation. Some of their bishops reject Christ. We're talking official heirarchy speaking from official positions.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Is there a meaningful difference between Anglican and Catholic Doctrine?

Actually yes. They believe in 2 sacraments (Eucharist and Baptism) instead of 7 (I think its seven) and elevate Scripture higher than Tradition (not sola, necessarily). Justification by grace through faith. The whole celibacy of priests and women ordination is considered a doctrinal difference (as is who gets to appoint Bishops, etc - though that's more an ecclesiastic difference than a doctrinal one, IMO).

The Catholic Encyclopedia says:

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/01498a.htm

There can be no doubt that the English Reformation is substantially a part of the great Protestant Reformation upheaval of the sixteenth century, and that its doctrine, liturgy, and chief promoters were to a very considerable extent derived from, and influenced by, the Lutheran and Calvinistic movements on the Continent.

[Ben Kenobi]

Please don't be ridiculous. If you're seriously trying to argue that Britain wasn't a major power until the 18th century, then you're a bigger dumbass than I thought.

They weren't. They were conquered by the Dutch.

[Ben Kenobi]

@Imran. Queen as their head is a huge difference between the two. Also, the heirarchy is not ran the same way, and their 'bishop of Rome' is Canterbury. These are not superficial changes.

[kentonio]

They weren't. They were conquered by the Dutch.

Ok it's official, you're a dumbass.

[kentonio]

Also, the heirarchy is not ran the same way

Dear lord, how are you a teacher..

[DinoDoc]

L2Post, Ken.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Right now? Anglicans believe in female priests, abortion, contraception, gay marriage, and have the queen as their head. Some of them reject transubstantiation. Some of their bishops reject Christ. We're talking official heirarchy speaking from official positions.

You realize that the Episcopalian Church and the Anglican Communion are two separate things, right - the TEC being a member of the Anglican Communion, but not speaking for the whole?

[Ben Kenobi]

You realize that the Episcopalian Church and the Anglican Communion are two separate things, right - the TEC being a member of the Anglican Communion, but not speaking for the whole?

I'm aware that the 'Church of America' is a subset of the Anglican communion, like the Church of England, and the Church of Ireland, etc.

[Ben Kenobi]

Ok it's official, you're a dumbass.

A nation ruled by the Dutch and then random German nobodies from Hanover is more prestigious than France under the Sun King or Spain under the Habsburgs, or Austria under the Habsburgs.

Some called it 'Glorious'. There wasn't much glorious about it. Other than the emblazoned prejudice of the Test Act that still bars Catholics from the throne. But I guess that's what happens when you become a fief of the Dutch. England in the 17th isn't Victorian England in the 19th.

[Ben Kenobi]

Dear lord, how are you a teacher..

It's not. There are substantial differences between the organization within the Catholic church and the organization within the Anglican church.

[Elok]

Conquered by the Dutch? The DUTCH?!?

When did that happen? Was there ever a period where the Netherlands actually invaded another European power and won? I don't recall hearing that they were even especially good at beating up on smallpox-ridden Native Americans...

EDIT: Ah, the Glorious Revolution. I'd forgotten about that particular historical hiccup. Reminds me of that time we conquered Iraq...

EDIT TWO: No, I'm thinking of a different historical cockup, aren't I? Anyway, that happened after they acquired (and lost) control of pretty much all of the East Coast of NA, so yeah, they were kind of a big deal even before Victoria.

[Elok]

Also, BK, he was referring to your grammar. "The hierarchy is not run the same way."