Hammer and Sickle: As Offensive as the Swastika?

[Alexander's Horse]

Ben just keeps sort of gibbering away...you'd have to switch off the machine and gag him as well

[Ben Kenobi]

Yeah I can see how someone as braindead and retarded as you might get worried when the state says it's okay to pull the plug on people in vegetative states who will never recover

They didn't 'pull the plug'. She was breathing on her own. All she needed is the same thing everyone else does - food and water. They had to starve her to make sure she died. Did she suffer? Yes, terribly so. For close to a month.

the person making the decision is their spouse.

And in this case she didn't have a 'spouse'. That means her family had the responsibility. Her family wanted to take care of her.

She had no awareness of what was going on so it's not like she experienced a "horrible, horrible thing"

Yeah, she could feel pain, just like the rest of us. And yes - she suffered when she was starved, same as the rest of us would.

Also, LOL at the notion that putting a feeding tube in someone's mouth and force feeding them is somehow "leaving them alone" while not putting a feeding tube in them isn't.

Since when is feeding someone 'extraordinary' care that can be withdrawn? See - this is the point. This is why it pissed people off so much.

[Ben Kenobi]

Let me put it this way.

How do we know what Terri wanted? Did she write it down anywhere what she wanted and why? Did she write anything to Michael saying, "In the event I am incapacitated, I want to die?"

How do we know what Terri wanted? The only evidence that she wanted to die is from Michael Schiavo - and his account isn't corroborated by the rest of her family. One would think that if her desires were very clear - that there would be agreement. This we do not see.

Where's the evidence? Where's the written piece of paper from Terri saying that this is what she wanted?

[giblets]

I'm glad the courts took Michael Schiavo's side. No point in sustaining someone who is in a vegetative and will never recover. And her spouse was the best qualified person to speak for her in absence of a living will. I'm glad you're angry.

[Ben Kenobi]

No point in sustaining someone who is in a vegetative and will never recover. And her spouse was the best qualified person to speak for her in absence of a living will.

Didn't you just say it was impossible to be married to such a person? Then he's not her spouse anymore.

[giblets]

He was her spouse when she wasn't a vegetable and therefore is better qualified to judge what she would want than anyone else is.

[Ben Kenobi]

He was her spouse when she wasn't a vegetable and therefore is better qualified to judge what she would want than anyone else is.

Then why isn't there anything to prove this is what she wanted?

[giblets]

I guess she neglected to leave a living will while she was still up and about.

[Ben Kenobi]

I guess she neglected to leave a living will while she was still up and about.

See, this is the problem. Even if you agree that this is the right thing to do, I'm very uncertain that this is what Terri Schiavo wanted. There's no evidence, except from Michael Schiavo who's got a conflict of interest.

I've got a will myself and it's *very* specific on who makes the decisions and on what. Three of the clauses in it are 'Terri Schiavo' clauses, stuff I put in because of Michael's bull****. I need to print off a copy though and put it in with all my documents so that it can be found by someone rather easily.

[giblets]

You're rather paranoid. Are you sure you shouldn't be wearing a Stalin avatar?

[Ben Kenobi]

You're rather paranoid. Are you sure you shouldn't be wearing a Stalin avatar?

Given recent events I wasn't paranoid enough.

Let's see, I live by myself with people that I don't know all that well in a foreign country. If something happens to me I have to take the steps to make sure that things are planned and so that someone who does know me can actually find me and my stuff.

[Dr Strangelove]

Answer the question Sava! You say you're all about choice - should a man get to choose for his wife whether she lives or dies?

This take me back. When I was knee high to a grasshopper ... an intern, I cared for a woman who was dying of metastatic breast cancer. She had failed all treatments. There was nothing left to do. As it so happens she had divorced a few years earlier. She expressed to me regret over the divorce, she wished that she wished for her husband to be at her side with her children, a united family. Her kids (teenagers) and huisband came by, the kids were obviously goading the father, so the father asked me if there was anything she had asked for. I told her about her wish. He got a priest to come to the hospital and remarry them. She died.

Then the hospital presented him with the bill.
Apparently he had divorced her originally to avoid the devastating cost of caring for her when she was first diagnosed with cancer.
He filed a lawsuit against the hospital because he felt we had tricked him into remarrying her.
I recorded an affadavit with his lawyer that convinced them that I merely relayed her wishes without the intent of entrapping him.

Bazinga!!!

My wife is lying in the other room dying of cancer. She has a large tumor in her liver, so large that it actually sticks out. A biopsy was done yesterday, but evidently the prognosis is so bad the her personal physician won't tell us the results but instead is deferring it to the oncologist she'll see Monday. Maybe she might require extraordinary care at a top notch cancer center, but she's not going to get it. Why? Even though I'm a Board Certified Internist with 30 years experience I'm facing bankruptcy. I haven't been paid for 4 months, Most of our patients are Medicaid. The state and the HMOs that function on behalf of the state to provide insurance for Medicaid patients haven't paid us in 4 months, despite the fact that Virginia has a budget surplus. Evidently the GOP government doesn't beleive it has to pay for services rendered.
Swatika = GOP = godless degenerates.

[SlowwHand]

The last part about a political party is way off the mark. I'm sure I need to attribute it to the stress of the times.

[Kidlicious]

Doc, that's tough. Sometimes when it rains it falls. Stay strong.

[Ben Kenobi]

Doc, I think you did the honorable and decent thing. You put the woman at peace. The system on the other hand? That's real scummy.

If I were the man, I'd probably explain the situation and put out a kickstarter or something. Advertise the name of the hospital and the management so that everyone knew the players and the particulars. Dickery deserves rightful retaliation.

As for your wife, I am very sorry to hear that Doc.