A Bible question!!

[BlackCat]

God kills people all the time as part of his plan. Frankly, your lack of faith is disturbing.

You stole my line

[Elok]

Just to be a pain in the ass, I'd like to point out that abortion is never once mentioned in the Constitution either, yet somehow it's a constitutional right. Not seeing why the government can make up rules but the Christian church can't (note that this argument all goes away if one does not subscribe to the obviously incorrect Protestant doctrine of sola scriptura ).

Or, if that doesn't work, MrFun, the Bible says abortion is wrong right next to the part where it says "oh, and we were totally j/k about all that 'gay sex is bad' stuff, so feel free to ignore that." Honestly, you can't have been looking very hard.

[Ben Kenobi]

need to do a better job in helping and taking care of pregnant women, especially single one, and our loss of community has made it all the more difficult).

Absolutely. If their most attractive option is abortion, then that doesn't say much about everything else. Oftentimes abortion is used to cover up rape.

[Nikolai]

From a Christian perspective it's clear that abortion is wrong. But it's never black and white. If you have to choose between the woman's life and the child's life, you need to make a decision, as as most of my likeminded, I then choose the woman's life. In any case, not making a choice IS a choice in itself, as it would mean choosing the kid's life. I believe the woman, who have lived and have loved ones here, should be prioritized then.

But then there is the question of rape. I have problems defending abortion as being wrong here, but I don't have any biblical basis for that, only my conscience. In the first two, it's pretty straight forward, biblical speaking, as I understand it. For the last situation, I'm at a loss biblically. I can't defend either from the Bible. As a Christian, I want to follow the Bible and my conscience, and lacking biblical basis for this situation, I'm open for abortion in such cases, under some strong doubt. It's not the kid's fault after all. It's hard, and it's no good solution either way.

[Tuberski]

Knowing the existence of somebody implies knowledge of their actions.

No.

ACK!

[BlackCat]

No.

ACK!

If you are an allmighty and allknowing god, you do

[Tuberski]

Then, Yes.

ACK!

[grumbler]

Just to be a pain in the ass, I'd like to point out that abortion is never once mentioned in the Constitution either, yet somehow it's a constitutional right.

There are no "constitutional rights" in the US (I assume that this is the US you are talking about). There are "constitutionally protected rights," and some (but, explicitly, not all) of the protections are listed in the Bill of Rights. Among the others not listed, but recognized, are rights such as self-defense and privacy. Roe v Wade was decided on the basis of the right to privacy, not the "right to abortion." That is made quite evident by the fact that RvW explores where the state's power (not right; states have no rights) to over-ride a woman's right to privacy with regards to abortion begins.

What the bible, or Hammurabi's Code, or Norse mythology says about abortion may be interesting, but it is moot from a legal and real-world standpoint.

[Ben Kenobi]

But it's never black and white

Yes, it is black and white. Sorry, Nikolai, you're wrong here. Abortion is wrong. That's all there is to it.

[BlackCat]

Yes, it is black and white. Sorry, Nikolai, you're wrong here. Abortion is wrong. That's all there is to it.

No, it's only in some christian view (and maybe a couple of other religious beliefs) that it's wrong. Outside such, it's not ethically nor morally wrong to have an abortion.

[Dr Strangelove]

I was wondering when this would be pointed out:

Jeremiah 1 (NIV):
4 The word of the LORD came to me, saying,
5 “Before I formed you in the womb I knew[a] you,
before you were born I set you apart;
I appointed you as a prophet to the nations.”

Hmm, wait a second, it says before I formed you...I knew you, not "from the moment I knew you". I think the use of the word "before" implies this verse applies specifically to Jeremiah, that he was always destined to be a profit. Generalizing this verse to everyone would indeed mean that free will could not exist. It would mean that God chooses all conceptions, and it would also mean that we're all set apart to be prophets to the nations.

[Dr Strangelove]

according to wiki not all ectopic pregnancies are doomed to die, but dangerous for the woman if allowed to grow to viability.



is it sinful to save the life of a woman by aborting the baby?

Four cases out of tens of thousands?

There are other conditions where preganacy may endanger the life of the mother at a point in gestation prior to fetal viability. Certain congenital heart conditions, especially those which cause blood to be shunted away from the lungs may impair the Mother's ability to handle the extra circulatory load of pregnancy to the point that she can't carry a fetus beyond 20 weeks.

[Nikolai]

Yes, it is black and white. Sorry, Nikolai, you're wrong here. Abortion is wrong. That's all there is to it.

No it isn't. There are grey areas. Abortion as a general rule is wrong, but life is not easy and sometimes there is no right choice. Like if there is a choice between the kid's life and the mother's. You can't honestly believe it is as easy as the woman should die for the kid to survive? She is a God's child as much as it! Life isn't always black and white, few rules are without exceptions.

[Nikolai]

No, it's only in some christian view (and maybe a couple of other religious beliefs) that it's wrong. Outside such, it's not ethically nor morally wrong to have an abortion.

We're discussing within a Christian framework here BC.

[BlackCat]

We're discussing within a Christian framework here BC.

No problem - just don't make it into how the real world handles it

PS. Have you checked out the desperation movie ?