Is anyone here unfortunate enough to be an obsessive racist?

[Al B. Sure!]

Acts 4:10-12

10Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
11This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
12Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

John 14:6

6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

John 3:36

He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

John 8:24

I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

1 John 5:11-12

11And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

12He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

[Al B. Sure!]

Galatians 2:16-21

Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

17But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

18For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.

19For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.

20I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

21I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Ephesians 2:8-9

8For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Romans 10:9

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

[Asher]

What the **** just happened?

[Al B. Sure!]

I don't think there's any ambiguity. You can only achieve salvation through faith in Jesus Christ as the Son of God.

As for the spreading of the Word...

Matthew 28:18-20

18And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

19Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

20Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world.

John 20:21

Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you.

2 Timothy 4:2-5

2Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine.

3For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

4And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

5But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry

2 Corinthians 5:20

20Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

[notyoueither]

So only Catholics can discuss what faith is.

No. Faith is a private matter between a human and its conscience.

You are no more capable of defining who other than you has faith, or in what, as Ben is capable of defining what makes for a healthy relationship for others.

The problem is, we're defining who Catholics are. You seem to think anyone who claims themselves to be a Catholic is a Catholic. I think that's absurd, but whatever.

I'll solve this academic dilemma you've created: I am now a Catholic. Let us proceed with the discussion, and as a Catholic I can provide my input. I don't believe in the teachings of the Catholic Church, but apparently this isn't a prerequisite anyway.

You are probably slightly less Catholic than Ben is gay.

Do we listen to fundamentalist Muslims who blather on about Sharia? Do we think that Muslims who do not chain themselves to the twelfth century are not Muslims?

[Al B. Sure!]

What the **** just happened?

What? What happened?

[Al B. Sure!]

I find it very odd that the Christians want to just skip over the fact that salvation can ONLY be had through acceptance of Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. WHAT THE HELL?!

John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

[Asher]

No. Faith is a private matter between a human and its conscience.

You are no more capable of defining who other than you has faith, or in what, as Ben is capable of defining what makes for a healthy relationship for others.

Hey, they may have faith in God, or whatever they want to believe. But if they claim to be Catholics, their faith must be Catholic Faith. Catholic Faith has some rigour to how it's defined.

If you don't like how Catholicism works, go start a Protest religion.

This isn't a theological argument, it's a practical one. I'm not going to get up in the business of the Bible. If being Catholic means following the Catholic Church, people who don't follow the Catholic Church are not Catholic.

Do we listen to fundamentalist Muslims who blather on about Sharia? Do we think that Muslims who do not chain themselves to the twelfth century are not Muslims?

I don't know anything about the Muslim faith aside from their affinity for airplanes and explosions.

But I will say this: Someone who calls themselves a Muslim but follows the teachings of the Roman Catholic Church is not a Muslim.

[notyoueither]

What the **** just happened?

We been Catholic-jacked.

[Asher]

What? What happened?

Some **** started gaying up this thread with scripture

[notyoueither]

I find it very odd that the Christians want to just skip over the fact that salvation can ONLY be had through acceptance of Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior.

John 14:6

That doesn't say anything about being a Catholic, or listening to the Pope if you are.

[Jon Miller]

I find it very odd that the Christians want to just skip over the fact that salvation can ONLY be had through acceptance of Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. WHAT THE HELL?!

John 14:6

Umm, while you definitely have a reasonable interpretation, it is not the only one (and there are reasons why people have not thought so often throughout history). Just because someone is saved by Christ doesn't mean that they even know of His existence.

Just like I could stop a terrorist (who had a nuclear bomb/etc), not have any proof of it, and then people could choose to beleive that they were never in any danger and that I didn't save them. Wouldn't change the fact that they were saved by me.

JM

[notyoueither]

Hey, they may have faith in God, or whatever they want to believe. But if they claim to be Catholics, their faith must be Catholic Faith. Catholic Faith has some rigour to how it's defined.

If you don't like how Catholicism works, go start a Protest religion.

That's about as retarded as some Liberal from Ontario screaming at me that if I don't like how Canada works I should move to Texas.

This isn't a theological argument, it's a practical one. I'm not going to get up in the business of the Bible. If being Catholic means following the Catholic Church, people who don't follow the Catholic Church are not Catholic.

You do not define what makes a Catholic. The Pope does not define what makes a Catholic, entirely.

There are many Catholics who veer strongly to the secular. They can still be Catholics.

I'm not even sure that people who are excommunicated would all accept that they are not Catholic. Some may say '**** you, Pontius Pope' and it would not affect their faith one jot. I also would not be surprised if some priest performed the sacrements for them, especially last rights.

[Asher]

The fact that a whole bunch of people consider themselves to be Catholic isn't a valid argument.

As far as I know, being Catholic means you follow the doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church. Period.

I realize there's a great many (a majority, perhaps) of people labeling themselves as Catholic while picking and choosing random parts of the RCC Doctrine they like. That doesn't mean they're Catholic, it just means they identify as Catholic.

It makes no sense at all for someone who is pro-choice, pro-gay marriage, etc to consider themselves Catholics. At all. If they are following a doctrine separate and distinct from the RCC doctrine, they should call themselves something else.

[Al B. Sure!]

Some **** started gaying up this thread with scripture

What the hell? That was me and I was PROVING OUR POINT with SCRIPTURE!