Christian Bigots Attack Elephant at Secular Institution

[OzzyKP]

Are you serious? You're comparing this, AT A ZOO, to a Cross?

The zoo even said they modeled it after Ganesh. It certainly looks like Ganesh to me. Are you denying a connection to the Hindu deity, Ganesh? Or are suggesting that Hinduism somehow doesn't count when trying to enforce secularism?

I don't have a problem with the statue, but I just think it is rather hypocritical that the folks who would be first to attack a statue of Jesus or Mary or something, get defensive when some Christians do the same thing.

[Tattila the Hun]

With a fat elephant on the cross. Win -win.

We had a pig, once, here in Finland. Caused something of an uproar.

Come to think of it, this probably offends both Christians and Muslims. Two birds with one stone! (That offends PETA, no doubt.)

[Asher]

The zoo even said they modeled it after Ganesh. It certainly looks like Ganesh to me. Are you denying a connection to the Hindu deity, Ganesh? Or are suggesting that Hinduism somehow doesn't count when trying to enforce secularism?

I don't have a problem with the statue, but I just think it is rather hypocritical that the folks who would be first to attack a statue of Jesus or Mary or something, get defensive when some Christians do the same thing.

It's a stylized elephant, donated to the zoo, put in front of an elephant exhibit.

Why would putting a statue of Jesus or Mary there be at all appropriate?

[duke o' york]

It certainly looks like Ganesh to me.

Ganesh, in the traditional representation, has a massive pot belly. So it's not a perfect Ganesh, but yeah, it does look like the Hindu god. This doesn't explain why the Christians are so het up about the statue. Didn't god make man in his own image? So every visitor to the zoo is a representation of god. Christianity is surely the big winner here.

[duke o' york]

Come to think of it, this probably offends both Christians and Muslims.

What offends me is the lack of comprehension of how bloody hard it'd be to put a nail through a pig's trotter.

[edit]Also why a pig would wear gold eye-liner.[/edit]

[Ben Kenobi]

Yes, we all know how well a crucifix would go over.

I'm actually in support of this. I'm tired of Christians taking crap whenever they have a public display. I'm tired of people taking a dump on Christmas. So goodbye Ganesh!

[Ben Kenobi]

Why would putting a statue of Jesus or Mary there be at all appropriate?

What about a quote from Genesis? I could certainly see a zoo having that, and we all know you'd be up in arms about it.

I don't know what's funnier, the fact that the biggest whiner about Christianity is *****ing about Christians once again.

[duke o' york]

Yes, we all know how well a crucifix would go over.

I'm actually in support of this. I'm tired of Christians taking crap whenever they have a public display. I'm tired of people taking a dump on Christmas. So goodbye Ganesh!

So forgiveness means nothing to you then? Why wouldn't it be better to accept the Ganesh-resembling statue while there are images of Jesus, Martin Luther, Muhammed, Buddha, Confucius, Thor, Isis et al as well? Hell, stick up images of Cthulu (sp?) and Obi Wan too to represent all worshipped religions.

Surely you should be happy to let them worship their false idols, safe in the knowledge that you have the one true faith, but then help them to realise their mistake and try to convert them to Catholicism, whether they want to or not.

[Ben Kenobi]

So forgiveness means nothing to you then?

What is there to forgive? Obviously, asher, et al aren't interested in anything resembling 'forgiveness', 'tolerance' or 'acceptance' wrt to Christian displays in public.

Why wouldn't it be better to accept the Ganesh-resembling statue while there are images of Jesus, Martin Luther, Muhammed, Buddha, Confucius, Thor, Isis et al as well? Hell, stick up images of Cthulu (sp?) and Obi Wan too to represent all worshipped religions.

Look, you can't put up a Christmas tree in a library because it offends some *****s, so I sure as heck don't want a Ganesh. Let us put up Christmas trees and show some understanding and then we can talk about Ganesh. Personally, I don't mind it at all, but I get sick and tired of people demanding that Christianity be purged from the public sphere.

Surely you should be happy to let them worship their false idols, safe in the knowledge that you have the one true faith, but then help them to realise their mistake and try to convert them to Catholicism, whether they want to or not.

Hmm.

Actually, the proper Christian response is to destroy idols altogether. Do you really want that type of response?

[duke o' york]

What is there to forgive? Obviously, asher, et al aren't interested in anything resembling 'forgiveness', 'tolerance' or 'acceptance' wrt to Christian displays in public.

Judge not others by how they treat you; treat them in the spirit expected of a Christian. Turn the other cheek for goodness sake.

Look, you can't put up a Christmas tree in a library because it offends some *****s, so I sure as heck don't want a Ganesh. Let us put up Christmas trees and show some understanding and then we can talk about Ganesh. Personally, I don't mind it at all, but I get sick and tired of people demanding that Christianity be purged from the public sphere.

You shouldn't be engaging in a debate about whose religion is better. Stay true to your own, and you'll go to heaven. If you can convince others to change to your religion then all the better for it, but don't attack them for not practising yours.

Actually, the proper Christian response is to destroy idols altogether. Do you really want that type of response?

Jesus preached tolerance, and so I'd expect his followers to be tolerant of those who choose to follow other religions, rather than destroying their idols. His ideal was for you to convince them to abandon their religion and follow his/yours, then for them to destroy their own idols.

Or did I completely misunderstand my Catholic school's teachings (even if I ultimately rejected their religion, the guiding rules are mostly sound), and you should re-enact the Inquisition? This can't be the Christian way, nor should it be, even to someone who has only flicked through the Bible, rather than read the whole lot as I have (apart from my schooling in the New Testament, I read the rest because it was vital secondary reading for anyone studying sixteenth century literature at uni).

[Ben Kenobi]

Judge not others by how they treat you, treat them in the spirit expected of a Christian. Turn the other cheek for goodness sake.

So that means Christians should stand quietly by rather than standing up for themselves?

You shouldn't be engaging in a debate about whose religion is better

If we sincerely believe that those who reject Christ are condemned to hell, we have a duty to share the Gospel with everyone.

Stay true to your own, and you'll go to heaven. If you can convince others to change to your religion then all the better for it, but don't attack them for not practising yours.

Debate!= attack. And yes, I think we can criticse someone for their religion. Heaven knows it's thrown in our face enough times.

Jesus preached tolerance, and so I'd expect his followers to be tolerant of those who choose to follow other religions, rather than destroying their idols.

You know nothing of Christ. He was tolerant of sinners, in calling them to love God, and return to him. He was not tolerant of idols.

His ideal was for you to convince them to abandon their religion and follow his/yours, then for them to destroy their own idols.

Yet, he says, "I come not to bring peace, but a sword. I shall divide families, and set brothers against one another."

Or did I completely misunderstand my Catholic school's teachings (even if I ultimately rejected their religion, the guiding rules are mostly sound), and you should re-enact the Inquisition?

It's one thing to tolerate sinners, another to tolerate Idols, and yes, they have been smashed and destroyed in the past.

This can't be the Christian way, nor should it be, even to someone who has only flicked through the Bible, rather than read the whole lot as I have (apart from my schooling in the New Testament, I read the rest because it was vital secondary reading for anyone studying sixteenth century literature at uni).

Then you ought to be familiar with Dagon, and the story with how YHWH humbled Dagon in the temple. I understand the principle of religious tolerance, and how we ought to permit people to worship freely, but this includes Christianity too. Christmas trees, crucifixes have just as much right to expression in the public sphere as any other faith. This is what atheists do not understand. If you discard the principle of religious freedom to engage in persecution of Christianity, then you are returning to the days in which idolatry was not tolerated. What on earth makes you think that you will make the rules and can reap the whirlwind?

[duke o' york]

I haven't attacked Christianity in any way, nor its right to display its symbols as much as any other religion.
It is as valuable as any other religion, and as worthy of its representation as any other. Come up with an elephant saint, and Christians too can have a statue outside the elephant compound at the zoo.

Sorry Ben, but although I think you're a nice guy, I'm coming round to the opinion of most of the posters here that on topics of religion you won't let anyone else have any leeway and as such are worthless debating with.

[bumfister]

A FIGHT! A FIGHT!

[duke o' york]

I'm a Francophile, so it's more like A RETREAT! A RETREAT!

[KrazyHorse]

I don't remember Jesus being Canadian, or did I miss the fifth gospel, the one with the bears, the moose and the chapters in French, eh?

That would be ****ing awesome.

*begins scribbling*