Study: Gays in the military will not undermine effectiveness

[Ben Kenobi]

Of course they don't due to biological/physical differences between the two sexes...but of course, you already knew that.

Thanks. Which gets back to my point about decedence. Inclusivity has taken a more prominent role then effectiveness.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Seriously, Ben should be the first up on the wall when the revolution comes

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Thanks. Which gets back to my point about decedence. Inclusivity has taken a more prominent role then effectiveness.

Gay people are physically different than straight people?

[Asher]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

they allow you to serve unless you make an issue of it

Nope, they allow you to serve unless they find out you are gay in any potential way possible.

Btw, are guys that talk about their wives or banging their wives to other soldiers "making an issue" out of their orientation and should be kicked out too?

Ben should really watch "Carrier". Or any other military documentary.

Seems like all these guys do on the boat is talk about sex with women, their girlfriends back home...they've got skin mags and everything also. They're making a huge issue out of it.

[Ben Kenobi]

So you'd like to promote lying among our troops?

Again, if you aren't allowed to ask the question, how is it lying when you do not voluntarily disclose?

After all, while back in the bunks, I'm sure the topic turns to personal relationships and "would you look at the ass of that woman" and stuff like that.

Oh, Imran. I haven't served, but I don't make truth claims about the conditions of the barracks either.

Ben should really watch "Carrier". Or any other military documentary.

Seems like all these guys do on the boat is talk about sex with women, their girlfriends back home...they've got skin mags and everything also. They're making a huge issue out of it.

Hmm, more extensive experience in the barracks. I have to applaud both you and Imran for telling me what it's really like in the military.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Oh, Imran. I haven't served, but I don't make truth claims about the conditions of the barracks either.

If you don't think this goes on behind the scenes (as it does just about any time you get a bunch of non-pussified church boys guys together), then you are a bigger idiot than I thought possible.

[Ben Kenobi]

Gay people are physically different than straight people?

It's the same principle of making the military fit you rather then the other way around.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Hmm, more extensive experience in the barracks. I have to applaud both you and Imran for telling me what it's really like in the military.

Have you been around men once in your entire life?

You've got to be ****TING ME that you don't think men talk about women at all when they're away from their girlfriends/wives for weeks at a time. You are so thick.

[Theben]

I'm forwarding an idea for a bill to my congressman. It states that people who have changed their religious outlook can't be trusted with leadership positions in the military and should be regulated to assistant mess cooks.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
It's the same principle of making the military fit you rather then the other way around.

What physical tests TO DO THE JOB ITSELF do gay people fail that straight people don't?

[Patroklos]

You're just upset 'cause I'm clearly manlier than you are. This is what the Navy is afraid of, masculine gay guys emasculating people like you to the point that you're too scared to serve because I'd kick your ass for the snide homophobic remarks you make?

You are correct, I shouldn't hold you being an ass against all your compatriots. That is just your destructive influence.

Consequently, I have contacted the vast gay conspiracy, a new public affairs officer should be here soon.

You have been reasigned to the Apple tech forums.

It states that people who have changed their religious outlook can't be trusted with leadership positions in the military and should be regulated to assistant mess cooks.

That is a very difficult and important job, why do you hate the troops?

[Wittlich]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi

Thanks wittlich. Clearly the current policy is not barring those who wish to serve, as you have proven yourself.

Ah, but remember:

In order for me to complete my career in the military, I had to lie about myself, to myself and those around me...for over 20 years. When I first joined in 1980, Don't Ask, Don't Tell didn't even exist - so I was forced to constantly lie on my enlistment/reenlistment documents.

Constantly living a double-life for all those years does have its toll. Not everyone can do it or handle the constant pressure of "living the lie" in order to serve their country.

As a matter of fact, as I got close to retirement, my Mom and Dad lived in continual fear that the military would find out and that I would be kicked out just short of the required 20 years of service and have nothing to show for it.

I survived and I made it to retirement. Not everyone is like me nor am I like everyone else. Just because I served my 20 years does not in any way mean that the military's current policy is working or even fair for that matter.

[Ben Kenobi]

Then why don't you remove benefits for everyone, if this is your excuse?

Anyone who joins the military because of the sweet benefits would make a poor recruit. Anyone demanding that the military give them special treatment before they enlist should be shown the door.

The point is that they should serve because they want to serve, not because they are given benefits.

Why should we even ****ing pay soldiers? Why should their wives get money if their husband dies fighting for the country?

They haven't always gotten this, that is a relatively new change. It used to be they wouldn't get married until their service was done, and even if they did get married, they would hardly ever see their wife and kids, and when they passed on they wouldn't get any benefits at all.

Yet they still stepped up and served. That's the point of a voluntary army, that the people who are the most dedicated will be willing to step up and give their lives for their country.

**** off, Ben, you are seriously the most disrespectful polite person I've ever met.

That's quite a compliment coming from you.

Actually, you are the one making service conditional. If a soldier is discovered as being gay, he is kicked out. That is, by definition, CONDITIONAL.

If a soldier is discovered violating anything to do with the conduct requirements, they are kicked out. I'm sorry the military isn't like walmart. They are a bit more strict.

They're still asked if they have a partner. If I joined the US military and said no, I'd be lying. I do have a partner, of over 5 years.

Then perhaps you aren't cut out for the military asher. That's a pity. I'm sure the Canadian Forces will weep for their rejection.

I would LOVE for you to go to a military base in the US and let them know you do not agree that they get paid a salary and that their wives and children get medical insurance.

Where did I say that? I would say any soldier who would join only for the benefits would make a terrible soldier, and I'm sure they would agree with me here. Do you really want a guy watching your back, who has his primary concern of whether he gets his next paycheque?

[Ben Kenobi]

In order for me to complete my career in the military, I had to lie about myself, to myself and those around me...for over 20 years. When I first joined in 1980, Don't Ask, Don't Tell didn't even exist - so I was forced to constantly lie on my enlistment/reenlistment documents.

So why did you stay? If the policy was so repugnant to you, why didn't you quit? There was no one requiring you to remain in the military.

[Wittlich]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

So you'd like to promote lying among our troops?

After all, while back in the bunks, I'm sure the topic turns to personal relationships and "would you look at the ass of that woman" and stuff like that.

I had to if I wanted to serve my country - this was a part of the double-life that I was speaking of. I even found myself having to go to titty-bars and the like (and feign interest) so that no "gay flags" would be raised.