What's the record on children born of one marriage?

[General Ludd]

Originally posted by Joseph
Have you not heard that Middle East Arabs are now moving into France at a rate that will make them the largest pop. in France sometime this century. The Authors thinks it will be around 2050.

And if they live in France, they are citizens of France. So what the problem - where's the "take over"?

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


'Yes baby, I'm on the pill. Trust me.'

Hey! Stop that! It brings back bad old memeories!


Oh, and back when I went to medical school we were told that if we advocated the use of condoms as a form of birth control we could be liable for "wrongful life" if a girl got pregnant while a couple used them as their form of birth control.

[lord of the mark]

I have 45 nephews and nieces. I think. Id have to check the exact number with QOTM. Largest inlaw family is ten I think, but thats hardly the max in their community. I think over half of those have children already- im not sure how many grandnephews and grandnieces that makes. I dont think even QOTM has totaled it up lately. I DONT think any of the grandnephews or grandnieces has kids yet, but im not sure.

And they live in greater New York, NOT in Arkansas. The kids double and triple up, babies sleep in the parents room, and the teenage boys go off to Yeshiva at 14 or so. And pretty much everyone is married by about 19. So usually the older ones are out of the house by the time the younger ones are born. Food - they almost never eat out, they make most things from scratch, they shop at cheap, no frills, fruit and vegetable stands, etc. Clothes are passed down. Etc, etc.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
. There are still Irish, Italian, Polish, etc. ghettos in all the major cities.

Really? The only Irish ghettos I can think of in the US are in Boston, and maybe Bridgeport in Chicago. I used to live close to the Polish "ghetto" in Baltimore, and it barely seemed Polish - between assimilation, and the fact that lots of folks there were Germans, Italians, rednecks, and Latinos. Even Italian neighborhoods are on the decline in most places - even in Brooklyn.

Not to contest your main point, but the idea that theres still a vibrant urban ethnic community for "old immigrant" groups seems a bit of a stretch, except where there are recent new influxes (like Poles in Brooklyn, or Greeks in Baltimore)

[chequita guevara]

Maybe I'm generalizing from Chicago, then.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Maybe I'm generalizing from Chicago, then.

I bet Polish NW Chicago has been significantly reinforced by new immigrants since 1980. In fact Im virtually sure of it.

I suppose Boston and Philly still have Italian neighborhoods. NY youd think would still have them - i visit Bensonhurst not infrequently though, and it seems to be shrinking (chinese from one direction, hasidic Jews from the other) aging, and just less Italian then it was in say, 1975. Not sure where the young folks have gone - I presume the suburbs, where I suspect theyre NOT in Italian enclaves.

Bridgeport in Chicago (ill take your word its still completely Irish) is probably fairly unique, as are many things in Chicago.

[Ben Kenobi]

Oh, and back when I went to medical school we were told that if we advocated the use of condoms as a form of birth control we could be liable for "wrongful life" if a girl got pregnant while a couple used them as their form of birth control.

Uh, there isn't any concept of 'wrongful life' I think in any jurisprudence. The only cases they have had, have been tossed out.

[Ben Kenobi]

If I couldn't trust a girl why would I sleep with her without using a condom?

And that's my point about a girl who is on the pill. As a guy, you are trusting her to take responsibility. Condoms are about covering your ass, and a way for you to know that some protection will be there. The pill offers no such certainty.

[Wezil]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi
Uh, there isn't any concept of 'wrongful life' I think in any jurisprudence. The only cases they have had, have been tossed out.

I can't say for sure w/o some checking but I do seem to recall such a case. I believe it involved an abortion gone wrong.....

[BlackCat]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


Uh, there isn't any concept of 'wrongful life' I think in any jurisprudence. The only cases they have had, have been tossed out.

Nope.

http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/326/7393/784/b

[Wezil]

In the Cdn courts I found one case which was dismissed (was not brought in time - statute barred). The concept of "wrongful life" appears to be legally valid.

[GePap]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


Gepap PWND!

You are a silly bugger, aren't you?

Care to tell us how ineffective contraception is, genius? Oh, wait....

[Ben Kenobi]

For the first time in the Netherlands, a court has awarded damages to a severely disabled girl for the fact that she was borna so called "wrongful life" judgment.

The case of 9 year old Kelly Molenaar has led MPs to call for the Netherlands to follow France and ban damage claims for wrongful life. Doctors fear the judgment could lead to a sharp increase in defensive prenatal testing.

Interesting. I didn't know it had been passed in the Netherlands, and I hope the legislatures succeed in blocking further claims.

I think the concept of a 'wrongful life' is both arbitrary and dangerous.

[Ben Kenobi]

Care to tell us how ineffective contraception is, genius? Oh, wait....

If contraception were so effective, why are there still abortions? And it can't be just because those who have them were all not using contraception of some form.

As for the effectiveness, Doc Strangelove already answered that pont.

[GePap]

Originally posted by Ben Kenobi


If contraception were so effective, why are there still abortions? And it can't be just because those who have them were all not using contraception of some form.

Actually genius, that is EXACTLY WHY!!!!!

Jesus, H. Christ, what world are you from?

To have contraception you have to know about it, know were to get it, and be able to pay for it, or know how to get it for free. None of these would apply for many women, specially if folks like you control the education system and make sure women don't know their options.

As for the effectiveness, Doc Strangelove already answered that pont.

He was speaking for Condoms, AND in all honesty, I would prefer to see current numbers. And of course, anything used incorrectly will malfunction. Doc. said nothing about contraceptive pills.

Or are you incapable of reading?