Another Iraq thread: With friends like that...

[Mordoch]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
Uh, even if what the US said was true -- contested now by the Italian reporter -- there is such a thing called "warning shot."

Which the US troops said they did in fact do first but the car didn't stop. The reporter says she didn't see or hear warning shots, but its actually quite possible she just missed it, especially since she was in the back and apparently M-16 shots are not as loud as you might think they would be.

[Ramo]

From what I understand, the particular checkpoint was pretty deep in the checkpoint system due to its proximity to the Baghdad airport (supposedly an area better defended than the Green Zone), i.e. it's extremely unlikely that a suicide bomber could've gotten that far in the first place.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by One_Mean_Rabbit
Your jab implies that both cannot exist together??? Are you confused?

Show that how the two can be one and the same.

BTW do not write one tiny response per post.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Mordoch
Which the US troops said they did in fact do first but the car didn't stop. The reporter says she didn't see or hear warning shots, but its actually quite possible she just missed it, especially since she was in the back and apparently M-16 shots are not as loud as you might think they would be.

The reporter also said the US troops knew that they (she and escorts) were going to the airport to fly out.

[Mordoch]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
The reporter also said the US troops knew that they (she and escorts) were going to the airport to fly out.

Actually to the best of my knowledge she DIDN'T say that. She said she ASSUMED they knew because they had already passed through other checkpoints and she thought they should have let everyone up ahead know they were coming. We also have reports that the Italians refrained from letting the US know in advance they were coming, before they sent the car on the road. Furthermore, the reporter is just about the worse source in this case as far as determining whether the US knew they were coming. I'd be interesting in what the Italian intelligence agents in the car say about that.

[Giancarlo]

Originally posted by Oerdin


There are tons of Soviet made weapons in Iraq and I myself had a Libyan made AK-47 when I was there though I tossed it into the tigress because it was such a POS. AK-47 and
Iraqi made berretas are every where.

My dad fired an AK-47 and it jammed almost always not to mention squirted hot grease all over his hand giving him minor burns (while he was in afghanistan). Don't see why they are so reliable... it was one of those ****ty chinese copies.

Anyways, I can say that the italian woman is claiming all this **** has it all wrong. She thinks she knows everything.. what a idiot.

[MarkG]

Originally posted by Oerdin
Easy, it is hard to keep a good shot picture on a car speeding at 55mph. If you mislead the car then you end up shooting the **** out of the passenger compartment.

so you agree that it's a little hypocritic to say that they were aiming at the engine when simply, that's something impossible?

[Gatekeeper]

Objective journalism is a good thing. I had that drilled into my head from day one in J-school and, by God, if I ever end up with a reporter as biased as this Italian journalist appears to be, his/her butt is kicked out of the newsroom. We got enough screamers, hooters and hollerers in this damn world without having journalists sink to the samn damnable level.

Gatekeeper

[Gatekeeper]

Or, as editors are fond of saying: "Do your g*d*mn job and keep your damn biases out your copy!"

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Gatekeeper
We got enough screamers, hooters and hollerers in this damn world without having journalists sink to the samn damnable level.

European press by and large doesn't make a pretense of objectivity. That's an American conceit.

[Lawrence of Arabia]

tell that to fox news

[Sandman]

Originally posted by Oerdin
That's what they said on Fox News.

And how did they know? Did they ask the driver? Or maybe US soldiers carry speed guns, and they checked the speed before shooting at the car.

I certainly can't find any mention of this 55mph claim on the net, not at Fox, not anywhere.

[techumseh]

Italians grieve for hostage 'hero'
By Tamsin Smith
BBC News, Rome

Calipari is to be honoured with a state funeral
Italians queued quietly in the rain, waiting for their chance to file past the coffin of Nicola Calipari.
His body lies in state inside the marble Victor Emmanuel moment until Monday's funeral.

People reached out to touch the coffin draped in an Italian flag and stood still for a moment, before walking back down the steps in silence.

Occasionally there was an outburst of raw emotion.

"It's a crime!" shouted one woman leaving the monument.

Her fur coat quivered with rage and her face was wet with tears.

"More blood for American oil, but we only notice because now it's Italian blood!"

But generally the mood was muted and sombre.

'Twice a hero'

"Goodbye Nicola, you are the pride of all Italians," read one floral tribute laid on the steps beneath the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier.

You can't kill people for nothing

Giuseppe Chiummo
Mourner
"I wanted to come here because this man is twice a hero," said Paolo Daniele from Rome.

"He's a hero because he lost his life saving another. It's even more important than last time when we came here for our soldiers who died in Nassirya [in November 2003], because the work of this intelligence agent was peaceful is to save hostages' lives."

"A last goodbye to my countryman, that's why I'm here," explained Giuseppe Chiummo, a 24-year-old soldier.

"I'm so angry about this event because its incredible that those Americans didn't realise it was an allied convoy. You can't kill people for nothing."

"Nicola Calipari is a hero for my country," said his girlfriend, Orella, "but I'm very shocked at what happened and want to know the truth."

Price worth paying?

The demand for more answers is growing louder.

Giuliana Sgrena's harrowing account of the shooting written in Il Manifesto has inflamed suspicions and highlighted the information vacuum.


Many Italians are questioning the country's Iraq policy
She suggests that US forces deliberately targeted her because Washington opposed Italy's policy of dealing with kidnappers.

Parliamentary Relations Minister Carlo Giovanardi also said that he did not believe the American version of events.

The shooting has sparked diplomatic tension between Italy and America and has put pressure on Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi to take a tough stance with his close friend George Bush.

"We need to wake up to the fact that being America's ally in Iraq is a dangerous business," said Marco, holding a picture of the freed journalist.

"You get hurt no matter how friendly or faithful you are, which begs the question: Is it really worth it?"

Throughout the evening the steady flow of visitors continued to pay their respects to Italy's national hero.

Lines of umbrellas, throwing oversized shadows up the marble facade of the monument.

On Monday Italy bows its head for a state funeral but is still asking "Why?".

[Giancarlo]

funny how these people so fervantly believe in something that just isn't true... blame america for your screw ups.

http://www.washtimes.com/world/20050307-120131-5769r.htm

"ROME -- Italian agents likely withheld information from U.S. counterparts about a cash-for-freedom deal with gunmen holding an Italian hostage for fear that Americans might block the trade, Italian news reports said yesterday."

SO HOW THE **** WERE WE SUPPOSED TO KNOW?

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
Uh, even if what the US said was true -- contested now by the Italian reporter -- there is such a thing called "warning shot."

There were warning shots and the car kept driving.