Outsourcing Torture

[JimmyCracksCorn]

LA and Tuttle:

You realize this doesn't have much to do with Arar, right? Arar wasn't even in the US, except for an hour or two at La Guardia to switch flights. He was going back to Canada from Tunisia. He had Canadian and Syrian citizenship.

[Harry Tuttle]

Originally posted by JimmyCracksCorn
LA and Tuttle:

You realize this doesn't have much to do with Arar, right? Arar wasn't even in the US, except for an hour or two at La Guardia to switch flights. He was going back to Canada from Tunisia. He had Canadian and Syrian citizenship.

I'm just responding to LA's post about America protecting its citizens. This whole thread has been a pile since it was started.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Harry Tuttle


Well the point is that Switzerland and the United States are two completely different countries with two different circumstances, different responsibilities, different forms of government, and different threats.

And really, why should I try to answer a loaded question? "Why doesn't America protect its people?" - It does! The problem is that some of it's people are terrorists!

Neither Switzerland or Syria have you by the balls, so maybe you rationalize everything the US does, because you don't want to experience fear.

[Harry Tuttle]

Originally posted by Kidicious


Neither Switzerland or Syria have you by the balls, so maybe you rationalize everything the US does, because you don't want to experience fear.

Yeah that's it Kid. Good summation. Nice and articulate.

[Kidlicious]

I think so. What other reason could there be for people not being disturbed when their govt sends people to be tortured?

[Harry Tuttle]

Originally posted by Kidicious
I think so. What other reason could there be for people not being disturbed when their govt sends people to be tortured?

Because "Syria and Switzerland don't have you by the balls" is a reason?

[Lawrence of Arabia]

And really, why should I try to answer a loaded question? "Why doesn't America protect its people?" - It does! The problem is that some of it's people are terrorists!

then prosecute them - and put them through the american legal system. if they are guilty, then theres no reason to be worried that they dont get convicted. you can still prosecute terrorits, and have a law that prevents people in your country from being deported to a country where they can experience torture.

[Kidlicious]

It would be reasonable not to care whether Switzerland or Syria torture people, but unreasonable to not care if the US tortures people, because you are a US citizen. There's always the danger of the US toturing it's own citizen's. If you don't recognize that danger you must be rationalizing situations to avoid fear.

[Harry Tuttle]

Originally posted by Kidicious
It would be reasonable not to care whether Switzerland or Syria torture people, but unreasonable to not care if the US tortures people, because you are a US citizen. There's always the danger of the US toturing it's own citizen's. If you don't recognize that danger you must be rationalizing situations to avoid fear.

Or maybe I just don't care? Maybe you see things in black and white?

Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia then prosecute them - and put them through the american legal system. if they are guilty, then theres no reason to be worried that they dont get convicted. you can still prosecute terrorits, and have a law that prevents people in your country from being deported to a country where they can experience torture.

Ok, sure. To bad this whole hulabaloo was about a Canadian/Syrian.

[Lawrence of Arabia]

Ok, sure. To bad this whole hulabaloo was about a Canadian/Syrian.

who was in america, and instead of being deported to CANADA, he got deported to Syria. now thats barbaric. and canadian/syrians can still be tried under US courts, it doesnt change anything.

[Harry Tuttle]

Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia


who was in america, and instead of being deported to CANADA, he got deported to Syria. now thats barbaric. and canadian/syrians can still be tried under US courts, it doesnt change anything.

Actually it does change things. In fact, you were just arguing about American citizens.

In fact, as Jimmy just mentioned, it was a screw up. So why is this still being debated?

[Imran Siddiqui]

To show what happens when you decide torture is ok for some people.

[Ramo]

And why due process is a good idea.

[Lawrence of Arabia]

Actually it does change things. In fact, you were just arguing about American citizens.

nah, you gotta read more carefully. i wasnt only talking about american CITIZENS i was also talking about people who live in America. i dont think i used 'american citizen' once in the last coupla posts.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia
who was in america, and instead of being deported to CANADA, he got deported to Syria. now thats barbaric. and canadian/syrians can still be tried under US courts, it doesnt change anything.

It's barbaric to send people back to their country of origin where they are a citizen?

They talked to the Canadians all through out the process so its not like this was a big surprise to Canada.