Socialist claim victory in Spain

[The Templar]

Originally posted by PLATO
Did you read the article? Before the bombing the conservatives were expected to easily win. This is not punishment of the existing government for not caving into the liberal, despot supporting rantings of the ill informed anti-iraqi Freedom crowd. This is a populace caving in to terrorism. A bad precedent for sure.

And polls showed Max Cleland beating Saxby by 10 points the weekend before the Senate elections in GA. Lots of people say this is because Diebod voting machines were tampered with.

Polls don't always reflect what's going on.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by PLATO
BUT, doesn't the fact that al-Qaida may have influenced the outcome bother you?

People just realize that al-qaida is not the only cause of terrorism. There are deeper issues. If there is to be real long term change the left will be the one to lead us there.

[Wernazuma III]

Re: Re: Re: Socialist claim victory in Spain

Originally posted by PLATO
They changed the outcome of the election through the use of terror. How is it anything other than a victory for al-Qaida?

Sure, and the attacks of 9-11 didn't change the political landscape in the US? How can you expect that people don't think about such a large terrorist attack and it may effect their decisions...?

[General Ludd]

Re: Re: Re: Socialist claim victory in Spain

Originally posted by PLATO

They changed the outcome of the election through the use of terror. How is it anything other than a victory for al-Qaida?

There is no way they can lose, using that logic. No matter how the poll results where altered, it would bebecause of the bombings.

[yaroslav]

The defeat of PP is related to the way the have informed about the terror attack in the last three days: many Spaniards feel that the goverment has tried to hide that it was Al-Quaeda in order to no suffer electorally...

What is ironic, because only a few morons blame PP for the attack, but the majority blame them for hiding the information...

[GePap]

The PP had told the Spanish people that backing the invasion of Iraq as part of the war on terror, would make the Spanish people safer, hence even if the vast majority of Spaniards opposed the war, it was the right thing to do to keep them safe.

The bombings last week showed this to be false. The war in Iraq did not make the people of Spain safer. NOW, we get to an chicken and egg question: did Al Qaeda attack becuase Spain went to Iraq? Or would Al Qaeda have attacked anyways? Right now, no way to prove either. BUT, whichever is true, the PP contention that going along with the US into Iraq proved false becuase either it a. made Spain a target when it was not one before or b. did nothing to prevent Al Qaeda attacking Spain when it wanted to.

Is this a political victory for Al Qaeda? No. Spain will continue to aid the US in the war on terror (ie, the internaional hunt for AL Qeada which begun on 9/11). Spain will act to destory the cells that carried this out and bring those who did it to justice. It is a hit though at the Spanish conservatives and European allies of the BUsh admin. that went along with Bush in the claim that Iraq was an integral battle in the fight vs. AL Qaeda. NO evidence of that contention has come to light yet.

[Dr Strangelove]

I can sympathize with the Spanish people's displeasure at being involved in a war in Iraq inititated under false pretenses. Frankly I'd like to see Geo. Bush impeached after we get our troops out, which I hope will be this year. OTOH I have no quarrel with the legitimate war on OBL's organization. By knuckling in to pressure from al-Qaeda Spain may be inviting outright extortion. Will the socialists be able to resist? Probably, but what will OBL's men do if their demands are thwarted next time?

[Kontiki]

Originally posted by PLATO
Did you read the article? Before the bombing the conservatives were expected to easily win. This is not punishment of the existing government for not caving into the liberal, despot supporting rantings of the ill informed anti-iraqi Freedom crowd. This is a populace caving in to terrorism. A bad precedent for sure.

Or another way to look at it:

You have a right-wing government that decided to actively involve itself in the war in Iraq, believing that it was the right move in the "war on terrorism". One of the oft-cited claims of those involved in Iraq is that such action made the world safer overall and put a dent into the terrorist network. Then, all of a sudden, Spain is hit by a massive terrorist attack. A government that's already on somewhat shaky ground and that claims it's taking steps to make everyone safer seems to have lost it's biggest barganing chip, so they lose the election.

Note - I'm not passing judgement over the any political party in Spain, as I really don't know diddly about them. I'm just saying that this is another way to look at the events of the last few days.

[Bereta_Eder]

People realize who the main cause for their tragedy was. Iraq had nothing to do with combatting terrorism but actually re-enforced it. The people punished the real guilty onces.

[Bereta_Eder]

People realize who the main cause for their tragedy was. Iraq had nothing to do with combatting terrorism but actually re-enforced it. The people punished the real guilty onces. And will of course punish the guilty onces as well.

[Dr. Nick]

I guess being affected is only ok when you cast ballots in favour of neocons.

[yaroslav]

The defeat of PP is related to the way the have informed about the terror attack in the last three days: many Spaniards feel that the goverment has tried to hide that it was Al-Quaeda in order to no suffer electorally...

What is ironic, because only a few morons blame PP for the attack, but the majority blame them for hiding the information...

[Bereta_Eder]

yeah that played an important part as well

[Nubclear]

Re: Re: Re: Socialist claim victory in Spain

Originally posted by PLATO

They changed the outcome of the election through the use of terror. How is it anything other than a victory for al-Qaida?

Al Qaeda influenced the US political landscape, it influenced your laws, and it influenced your behavior.
So I guess one could say Al Qaeda triumphed over the United States?

[Az]

So paiktis, do you think that Al Qaeda attacked Spain to avenge Iraq?

I think it was the PP stupid "it's ETA" tactic that led to their demise in the elections. It was an obvious lie.