"When I'm a parent, I'm not going to punish my child! I will gently..."

[FlameFlash]

/me nods.

So does my son, though he also doesn't say yes to a diaper change often so we just don't ask...

Kind of like why one doesn't say, do you want to take a bath? Or what would you like to wear today?

You give options like "Would you like a story now or after your bath?" or "Which of these two shirts would you like to wear?"

[East Street Trader]

I have brought up just one child and she was a very biddable girl so discipline was never a big deal.

But I'll offer you what experience and thoughts I have.

It felt entirely natural to me to smack Lara when she was tiny. Although I can only remember doing so about three or four times.

Of course the smack does not hurt nor is it intended to. What it does is communicate rapidly and effectively that the child has done wrong and that you are displeased. It is the disapproval which hurts. And I do not believe that with a young child - two or three say - that the affront to their dignity matters very much, or indeed at all.

With a rebelious child I suspect I would be willing to smack right up to six or seven. But by then the ability to explain displeasure and its cause verbally is much greater and there is the chance to base discipline on some other form of punishment.

What I failed to do - mainly because the need to discipline was so rare - is to work out a graduated scheme of punishment so as to have an apropriate response at hand when the need arises. I used to get caught out. There would be a need to punish but the first thing I thought of doing by way of punishment would always seem far too severe and I could never rapidly come up with something which felt apropriate. So I'd finish up being lenient.

This did not seem to do any harm because of my daughter's nature. But a more unruly child might have suffered a bit.

Most people seem to base punishment on grounding the child for some period, shorter or longer, and I guess that is OK. But perhaps there are better things. Extra chores perhaps. Anyway my tip is to have a graduated scheme ready to hand.

The only other point I can contribute is that the age of two is a special period. It is then, I think, that the child begins to appreciate (at an intelectual level) that there is a world separate from themselves and that they have to adjust their own behaviour a little to accomodate it.

And this does not come naturally. It has to be learned. The upshot is that you should expect at least one stand up fight. In my case it came in the back of a car and the way I found to communicate to my two year old daughter that she would not always and inevitably get her own way was wholly phyical. Of course a mature man can suppress a two year old. But the battle of wills was fierce enough for me to remember it to this day.

Again I see nothing wrong with the physical nature of that confrontation. In fact I have no doubt that this is a lesson which must at least start to be learned within a family. Children nowadays get to start nursery schools younger and younger. In my view they do best if they are further down that particular mental road rather than less advanced.

So the terrible twos are a particular time, I think.

Which is my two pennyworth done.

Except to add that I have seen television programmes about really difficult children and my heart goes out to the parents in those cases. Doesn't sound as though you have that problem, though.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Re: "When I'm a parent, I'm not going to punish my child! I will gently..."

Originally posted by JohnT
Even with all evidence to the contrary, even knowing that we know, children will still lie to us to avoid whatever it is they want to avoid (in this situation a diaper change). I did it, my daughter does it, I'm sure y'all did it too.

So, how does one reason with a creature that will knowingly deny mountains of evidence? Answer: you can't.

But any suggestions would be appreciated.

Just change her diaper anyway - when she sees that she can't get out of it by telling an alternate version of the truth (that's pretty much how kids see it at that age) then she doesn't have much incentive - and you can always make the diaper change less pleasant by throwing in a lecture on the virtues of telling mommy and daddy when your diaper needs to be changed.

So, all you parents out there: what was the biggest shift from the imaginary to the real that you experienced? Were you rabidly anti-TV... until you needed some peace and quiet to get some work done so you decided to turn on the cartoons? Were you virulently anti-spanking until you just had to get the message across? Were you an anti-Santa Nazi who now gets sad because your kids no longer believes?

This slice-of-life has been brought to you by the family Thornton. All rights reserved.

None really - I used to think that changing diapers would be disgusting, but long before I became a parent for the first time almost 17 years ago, I had my nose broken enough times that I have a very limited sense of smell - some types of smells I simply can't detect, others are fine, most are fairly week.

Having a mid-teens daughter, I thought I'd be spending a lot more time sharpening my Ang Khola and cleaning a shotgun, but she's so much a workaholic super-achieving student that I try to get her to relax and unwind a bit more.

[TheStinger]

My 13 month old is too young for discipline alhtough we do say sternly NO when he bites us.

I hope i don't resort to violence to discipline him but i don't know how i will react in all situations

[DaShi]

Originally posted by JohnT


Nah... Sophie is aware that Daddy has a temper, but a diaper change is just a diaper change. She's at that stage where she doesn't care for us to do it, but doesn't want to learn how to use the toilet.

Clearly the solution is, if she doesn't tell you that she needs a diaper change, then you don't change them. Eventually, she'll get tired of the smell and tell you. Also, this will encourage to use the potty, as she won't want to be dependent on you all the time when she's uncomfortable. Then make her smoke a carton of cigarettes. That'll learn her good.

[JimmyCracksCorn]

I was never spanked and never had problems, my sister was spanked and she's a mess now...

Come on, guys... get a little creative. There are better ways to get a point across than hitting, in fact there are volumes of literature on child development and that addresses child learning in particular, why not look into it before belting your kid.

"It hurts but it works..." give me a break.

[JimmyCracksCorn]

And you know, a human child's ability for language comes long long before their ability to talk. I've seen studies where parents will teach their kids a basic form of sign language so they can sign basic things like "I'm hungry, dirty, etc, etc...", and it works. These babies cried far less often than other babies because they didn't need to since they had another way of communicating.

Edit: And there are studies that also show that the human brain (even one who's never had a child) is programmed to respond to the sound of a baby crying... there's something about it (and the respective part of our brain) that makes the sound almost impossible to ignore, and also one of the most annoying. So keep in mind, babies are programmed to cry and we're programmed to get annoyed by it. The sign language stuff also serves to reduce tensions of both the baby and parent, which is more likely to prevent spanking/hitting, whatever. And I think most spankers will admit that they often get some kind of release out of spanking their kid.

[JohnT]

Jimmy, you might be confusing cause and effect. Perhaps your sister was spanked because she was wild, and perhaps you weren't because you weren't.

[yavoon]

I wont spank my kids but electrodes sounds interesting

[loinburger]

My parents would always make me stand in the corner (basically equivalent to "taking a time out" or whatever the modern term is) until I told the truth. Sometimes it took several hours before I fessed up (I was a pretty stubborn kid), but eventually I'd relent. Obviously this won't work while the kid's diaper is full of crap, though, since you don't want to wait to clean that up.

[yavoon]

Originally posted by DaShi



Clearly the solution is, if she doesn't tell you that she needs a diaper change, then you don't change them. Eventually, she'll get tired of the smell and tell you. Also, this will encourage to use the potty, as she won't want to be dependent on you all the time when she's uncomfortable. Then make her smoke a carton of cigarettes. That'll learn her good.

poor technique. especially later. u'll end up w/ neglectful parents and a messy ineffectual kid.

[Japher]

You can't punish a little woman for lying. I think all females have this inbread into them. So, really, it's a loss clause

[JohnT]

Yeah, you don't want to let that stuff dry out.

[Starchild]

Originally posted by East Street Trader

The only other point I can contribute is that the age of two is a special period. It is then, I think, that the child begins to appreciate (at an intelectual level) that there is a world separate from themselves and that they have to adjust their own behaviour a little to accomodate it.

On the other hand, some children grow up to be like me. This so called "not-me" world is, at best, a source of me-fun and me-amusement. At worst, it's filled with all these meaty bag type things called "other people". Fortunately, such a view prevents one from being led astray by bad influences.

Starchild: a parent's mixed blessing since 1984.

[DaShi]

Originally posted by yavoon


poor technique. especially later. u'll end up w/ neglectful parents and a messy ineffectual kid.

The parents don't have to be neglectful. You can still ask, "Did you **** yourself?" and try to prod the child in the right direction, but make it clear that you need the child to tell you the truth in order to help it. The main lesson is that actions or inactions have consequences.