Dope: Should it be legalised.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by oedo

so you´re a vegetarian, live in a shabby, unheated flat and your clothes were knited by your grandma? (I assume you´re too young to drive a car, yet but you don´t plan to have one sometime anyway). impressive.

No, I meant that I'm not the one who cuts down the rain forest or pays workers poor wages (how bad globalization is is another argument anyways).

By the way, McDonald's doesn't buy meat raised on farms built where there used to be rainforest

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Flip McWho
1. True
2. Probably true
3. Not totally ineffective but pretty much.
4. Eh thats the workers fault for being in that black industry. Get a legal job.
5. Its about as dangerous as alcohol and ciggies.

Flip, didn't you read my post? Many studies have unveiled that legislation does not convince anyone not to do drugs. It is one of the least important reason.

In fact, pot use in the Netherlands has diminished since the legalization. QED, anyone?

[Whaleboy]

be consoled, skywalker... the drug legalization camp is made up entirely of upper middle class white college students. they are crazy anyway and I'm sure will grow out of their ignorance. they also lack the numbers to change anything.

Lower middle class philosophy, sociology, psychology and politics (pt) student. White. Nonetheless, if the best you can do is ad hominem, I suggest you stop. I can say stuff about the origin of anti-cannabis people, but I don't because I stick to attacking arguments, because it is the critical proposition of my view and refutation of my opponents that is my strength, due to the strength of the argument for legalisation. Nonetheless, in the UK, a politically significant number of people want to see it legalised. Can't remember exact figures, though I know its more than the anti-war people in UK.

The medical benefits don't require that it be legalized for general usage, just prescription usage. And in that case, I would hope heavy controls would be put on how it's prescribed. To my knowledge, it is only useful to ease the pain of a few arthritics.

MS as well IIRC. The medical benefits alone do not, but they demonstrate that it is not an entirely negative substance, "evil green", and has benefits. Consider that mankind has been using hemp and opium derivatives for millenia, though of course the latter is more problematic.

You fail to refute the libertarian argument (self explanatory), the taxation argument (self explanatory), the economic argument (popular stuff to sell), the sociological/crime argument (removes link to harder drugs, far cheaper and safer competition to dealers), the artistic benefits (tends to make people more expressive, many great artists were under the influence of marijuana, and many aspiring artists and writers too).

Also consider that since its so popular already, keeping it illegal is no longer practical, as is prosecuting the law. Indeed, you are criminalising one in seven of UK adults by keeping it illegal. Its hurting no-one but the user (and passive smokers but that can be dealt with by the tobacco argument), which is the individuals perogative. Are we going to ban all unhealthy substances? Tobacco, alcohol, fatty foods, oxygen?

[JimmyCracksCorn]

Hey, interesting side note:

Did you know that western society is the only society to use mind altering drugs (I consider alcohol a drug too) recreationally? Its true, all other cultures (until we corrupted them) used mind altering substances for ritual and religious reasons only. What bastards we are.

Thank god for the west.

Carry on...

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Albert Speer
be consoled, skywalker... the drug legalization camp is made up entirely of upper middle class white college students. they are crazy anyway and I'm sure will grow out of their ignorance. they also lack the numbers to change anything.

YEAH SURE.

Those Latinos and Blacks from the ghettos who are spending half their life in jail CERTAINLY agree with the drug ban, eh?

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Whaleboy

be consoled, skywalker... the drug legalization camp is made up entirely of upper middle class white college students. they are crazy anyway and I'm sure will grow out of their ignorance. they also lack the numbers to change anything.

Lower middle class philosophy, sociology, psychology and politics (pt) student. White. Nonetheless, if the best you can do is ad hominem, I suggest you stop. I can say stuff about the origin of anti-cannabis people, but I don't because I stick to attacking arguments, because it is the critical proposition of my view and refutation of my opponents that is my strength, due to the strength of the argument for legalisation. Nonetheless, in the UK, a politically significant number of people want to see it legalised. Can't remember exact figures, though I know its more than the anti-war people in UK.

The funny thing is that I pretty much fit into that category too

[Fake Boris]

Whaleboy, it is false to presume marijuana leads to other drugs anyway.

Following your reasoning, if marijuana disappeared, then there would be no more new drug adepts.

Following your reasoning, we should forbid a speed of 60 mph on the highways because it leads to 80 mph.

What you need to understand is that each drug has a social value. Marijuana fits the bill of the mainstream, widely accepted, cheap and pleasant drug; while any other drug could have this role.
In fact, studies show that even cocaine and heroine are not much more dangerous. There is no such things as hard or soft drugs. This is pure propaganda BS.

[Theben]

Originally posted by JimmyCracksCorn
Hey, interesting side note:

Did you know that western society is the only society to use mind altering drugs (I consider alcohol a drug too) recreationally? Its true, all other cultures (until we corrupted them) used mind altering substances for ritual and religious reasons only. What bastards we are.

Yeah, right...what have you been smoking.

Used to smoke, not any more. Should be legal, b/c it won't increase availability, can be taxed (btw, part of the tax can be used to pay for treatment, so if you don't buy it, you don't have to pay for their recovery), will reduce criminal profits, and allow people to know what's in their drugs (FDA regulated).

[Sava]

Originally posted by Albert Speer
I dont get this... Sava says weed is not chemically addictive based on a 1937 AMA report... a 66 year old report... sava, go back a few more years and you'll expose the truth that the negro has a small brain which is why he is less intelligent than whites.

wrongo... that report had nothing to do with addiction... you should learn to read speery pie

Skywalker... do you know what a chemical addiction is? Because judging by your posts, you do not. A "chemical addiction" is when your body becomes physically dependent on a substance (i.e. withdrawl when you don't get it). Withdrawl has very specific and pronounced symptons. I know because I've been on medications before that ARE chemically dependent. Marijuana is not chemically dependent. The medical community doesn't think so, no scientist thinks so... only drug warriors who are uninformed think so. As a user of marijuana I can testify to the FACT that marijuana is NOT CHEMICALLY ADDICTIVE. I've smoked marijuana daily for a month, then stopped cold turkey... and NOTHING.

In fact, marijuana is described as "anti-addictive" meaning... IT HELPS PEOPLE SUFFERING FROM WITHDRAWL FROM OTHER SUBSTANCES.

So far skywalker, you have been wrong on every point.

be consoled, skywalker... the drug legalization camp is made up entirely of upper middle class white college students. they are crazy anyway and I'm sure will grow out of their ignorance. they also lack the numbers to change anything.

wrong speer... the medical community doesn't agree with the prohibition... the vast majority of law enforcement doesn't agree with prohibition... judges don't agree with prohibition... and I suspect the vast majority of politicians don't agree with prohibition. That's why I can't understand why this lobby of drug warriors is so powerful in Washington.

To my knowledge, it is only useful to ease the pain of a few arthritics.

then your knowledge isn't that extensive

here's a short synopses from the NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF HEALTH

http://www.nih.gov/news/medmarijuana/MedicalMarijuana.htm

notice the .GOV

--Marijuana has analgesiac properties... relieving minor body pain, and relieving pain associated with cancer and chemotherapy treatments
--Neurological and movement disorders (multiple sclerosis, partial spinal cord injury, epilepsies, dystonic states,

Cannabinoids have shown efficacy as immune modulators in animal models of neurological conditions such as experimental allergic encephalomyelitis (EAE) and neuritis

-- Glaucoma
-- Appetite Stimulation/Cachexia

the list just goes on and on... but we really don't know for sure what medical marijuana could do BECAUSE THE DRUG WARRIORS WON'T ALLOW THE MEDICAL COMMUNITY IN AMERICA TO DO REAL SCIENTIFIC TESTS ON THE SCALES NECESSARY TO EVALUATE THE SUBSTANCE'S POSSIBLE USAGES.

So please Speery, skywalker... whoever... bring me your uninformed OPINIONS about marijuana. I'll lay down fact upon fact supported by mainstream medical sources. I'll BLOW YOU DRUG WARRIORS OUT OF THE WATER!

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by JimmyCracksCorn
Hey, interesting side note:

Did you know that western society is the only society to use mind altering drugs (I consider alcohol a drug too) recreationally? Its true, all other cultures (until we corrupted them) used mind altering substances for ritual and religious reasons only. What bastards we are.

Thank god for the west.

Carry on...

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Doesn't even desserve counter-arguments.

[JimmyCracksCorn]

Originally posted by Flip McWho
Also looking on the voting results. The vast majority of people that are against legalising it are people who have not had dope before. Interesting, I must say. Makes you wonder what they are basing their opinions on if they have never tried it.

Flip, whats the bud like in NZ?

Hey everyone, lets start a sub conversation.

What is the quality of weed like in your country/area and what is average price of a gram, half quarter, quarter, ounce, whatever? Also, how easy is it to get, ie do you have to go into the projects to get it, or does your neighbor deal? Lets try to determine which place has the best bang for your buck, then we can all meet up in said country and get blazed.

In Ottawa, its C$10 per G, $30 for a 1/2Q, $60 for a Q, although sometimes 55 or even 50. The quality is good, people say its not as good as BC bud, but on the few occasions I've tried some stuff from BC (British Columbia) I didn't notice much of a difference, it was just a bit smoother.

[JimmyCracksCorn]

Originally posted by Theben


Yeah, right...what have you been smoking.

Used to smoke, not any more. Should be legal, b/c it won't increase availability, can be taxed (btw, part of the tax can be used to pay for treatment, so if you don't buy it, you don't have to pay for their recovery), will reduce criminal profits, and allow people to know what's in their drugs (FDA regulated).

No, its true... I've heard this from multiple sources in multiple University classes. We're the only society to treat drugs in this way, historically I mean. Of course other parts of the world do now, but they never did before we came along.

Yeah, I never meant they don't do it now.

[Sava]

JimmyCracksCorn: In the Chicago area, good bud (dank) is between $30 to $60 for an eighth of a pound.

[JimmyCracksCorn]

Originally posted by Sava
JimmyCracksCorn: In the Chicago area, good bud (dank) is between $30 to $60 for an eighth of a pound.

An eighth of a pound?



Like how many grams is that....

[Sava]

Jimmy: between 2.5 and 3.5 I think... damn metric system