France bans religious symbols in schools and hospitals.

[Combat Ingrid]

I didn't know they planned to kill the muslims

[Kirnwaffen]

Simply ignoring the problem

This is precisely what the ban does! The problem is a fundamental lack of understanding between the Muslim minority and the rest of the French people, and, therefore, you need to do something to promote understanding, rather than simply sweeping the issues under the rug and pissing a whole bunch of people off with a superficial "solution".

[Ned]

Many others have pointed out that if you require uniforms, you can eliminate all sorts of "displays" in a "neutral" manner. To many here, this is anti-religion and in particular, anti-Muslim. I am sure this will not help France's relations with Muslim countries.

Also, it does undermine US foreign policy because we advocate freedom of religion as an essential freedom. We do so, because we believe it is.

[Saint Marcus]

::reminds Ned that France has better relations with Muslim nations than the US does::

Who's the Great Satan again?

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Saint Marcus
::reminds Ned that France has better relations with Muslim nations than the US does::

Who's the Great Satan again?

Er, not better relations with Iraqis, for example.

[Saint Marcus]

The Iraqis? They're busy killing American GIs, protesting the American occupation in Mosques, and so forth. And I still don't see Imams calling for a Jihad against France. Not even in Iraq (where Imams do call for a Jihad against the US).

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Saint Marcus
The Iraqis? They're busy killing American GIs, protesting the American occupation in Mosques, and so forth. And I still don't see Imams calling for a Jihad against France. Not even in Iraq (where Imams do call for a Jihad against the US).

The majority of Iraqis support the American presence. The Clerics who support the American presence are generally Shiites, and are called Ayatollahs. They dont call for Jihad against France, cause theyre not the kinds of clerics who call for jihad. Evidently you only see militant jihadi clerics as genuinely muslim, eh?

[Ned]

St. Marcus, Currently. But, what about the day after the ban goes into place?

But, I agree, even if France began to put Muslims in concentration camps they would not be as unpopular among the Muslim fanatics because it has no power.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Saint Marcus
::reminds Ned that France has better relations with Muslim nations than the US does::

Who's the Great Satan again?

France largely has better relations with Muslim STATES, in particular the secular ones, like Algeria for example. Even there support for Saddam can be seen in that context. Of course the hate filled Jihadis focus on the US, but I dont consider them representative of Islam.

[Shi Huangdi]

Originally posted by LDiCesare
I just want to point out that the law is not (yet?) voted.

I think one of the big cultural differences between France and other countries is that we tend to view religion as a private matter, and as such, any outward sign of religion is seen as proselytism.
I think that the law should state that religious symbols which hinder either education or treatment should be removed, respectively at school and at hospital.
This would force people to remove scarves to go swimming, which is sensible, and swimming can save one's life, yours or someone else's, so it must be taught. Same goes for hospital. The point is that if a patient refuses to be healed for religious reasons, the responsibility is his instead of the doctor's, as Spiffor already explained.

Wearing the skullcap/headscarf are both nessecary actions that are required by their respective faiths, and pose no direct harm to other people. Nor does wearing a skullcap by itself proselytize.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Saint Marcus
The Iraqis? They're busy killing American GIs, protesting the American occupation in Mosques, and so forth. And I still don't see Imams calling for a Jihad against France. Not even in Iraq (where Imams do call for a Jihad against the US).

'"The U.N. must not fail the Iraqi people again," Zebari said. "So we ask you today, please put aside your differences, pull together and work with us and all those who have contributed and sacrificed so much to realize our shared objective of a sovereign, united and democratic Iraq."


The Iraqi minister said afterwards that "we were critical of not only the U.N. but many other nations ... for doing nothing to help us overcome those years of dictatorship and tyranny and utlmost brutality." '

[Az]

Great decision. I wish we could have this around here, as well.

[Saint Marcus]

Of course the hate filled Jihadis focus on the US, but I dont consider them representative of Islam.

Polls held by Pew and Gallup from 2001-03, among others, all showed that the majority of the Muslims in the world think unfavorably of America. Even in "allied" muslim nations.

Now please some evidence that the general muslim populace thinks even WORSE about France, than about the US. No polls have shown this. No French flags burned. No jihads called against France. And not just the extremists are anti-American, the MAJORITY of the Muslims is anti-American.

But, I agree, even if France began to put Muslims in concentration camps they would not be as unpopular among the Muslim fanatics because it has no power.

You mean, if France did what the US is doing in Guantanomo?

[Saint Marcus]

and please note that in a Muslim nation such as Turkey, similar bans are in place.

[Az]

You mean, if France did what the US is doing in Guantanomo?

Troll.


we now resume our regular programming.