Was Hemingway a racist?

[Brundlefly]

I'm about halfway through reading The Sun Also Rises (excellent book, btw), and suddenly Hemingway uses the n-word about 15 times (in a narrative voice) within a span of 2 pages. Now, I know the book was written in the '20s and the story takes place in the '20s, but it's hard to tell if the author is narrarating this way because it was common language his readers would understand back then, or because he talked that way himself, or because he wanted the characters to talk that way.

[chequita guevara]

Re: Was Hemingway a racist?

Probably.

[Japher]

Richard Wright used "******" a lot and no ones has ever asked that question!

I think he probably was, he lived in Idaho after all.

What does it matter, it's a good book, and that is how a lot of the world was before civil rights actually came into effect.

[Sava]

Re: Re: Was Hemingway a racist?

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Probably.

Agreed.

[chequita guevara]

Re: Was Hemingway a racist?

Originally posted by Feephi
[Is] the author is narrarating this way because it was common language his readers would understand back then, or because he talked that way himself, or because he wanted the characters to talk that way.

All of the above?

[Dinner]

You also can't judge historical people's actions by modern standards. You must judging with in the context of the society in which they lived.

[Sava]

Originally posted by Oerdin
You also can't judge historical people's actions by modern standards.

sure I can...

You must judging with in the context of the society in which they lived.

Does this mean Hitler wasn't as bad because the Japanese atrocities were more brutal?

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Oerdin
You also can't judge historical people's actions by modern standards. You must judging with in the context of the society in which they lived.

No and Yes. We can judge the past according to our standards but we must allow for the different context. After all, it was someone in the past who said that future generations would look upon their failure to deal with slavery as a moral failing.

When we do stuff, we know that the future will judge us.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Sava
sure I can...
Does this mean Hitler wasn't as bad because the Japanese atrocities were more brutal?

No, it means you judge people relative to the society in which they lived. In 1940's society the Germans and Japanese were both swines but Hemmingway was just an other using the common language.

[chequita guevara]

As my Grammy used to say, "Back then we used ta call 'em niggamen."

Needless to say, I was very embarressed.

[Brundlefly]

Originally posted by Oerdin
You also can't judge historical people's actions by modern standards. You must judging with in the context of the society in which they lived.

So if Hem's words don't make him a racist because they were written in the 1920's, thus preserving his credibility to us, how should we look back on civil rights supporters from that era in the same context - as eccentrics? Or as visionaries amongst "racists-who-didn't-know-any-better"?

[Dinner]

He's an example of what I'm saying. Thomas Jefferson kept slaves and had sex with several of the female slaves yet in many ways he was liberal for his time. He taught black people to read, he allowed them to travel to nearby towns without asking if their work was done, he had a school & a church & decent houses (for slaves anyway) built for them, and he released them all upon his death. Compared to his peers he was actually very liberal while today we'd say he was a racist. Sure, he was a racist but compared to the society he lived in and came from he was actually very liberal.

[Japher]

I think we should look at each person as an individual and go from there.

I think if Hemingway was with us today he may be considered a racist as much as my great uncle is who still say Negro, say that today and you get looked at funny. Yet, Hemingway wasn't in the KKK AFAIK and he never killed a black man for sport... So, you decide. I don't think he would object to you taking either side of the debate as long as you took a side...

It's the same with Civil Rights activist. There have been good ones and bad ones...

Hemingway was the man

[Adam Smith]

If Hemingway is racist, what do you make of his attitues toward the Spanish or Hispanics in The Sun Also Rises, For Whom the Bell Tolls, and The Old Man and the Sea?

[Ben Kenobi]

It's the same question for Joseph Conrad who also uses the word in Heart of darkness.