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Well US policy has reformers and mullahs agreeing on one thing: getting nukes as fast as possible.
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“Now we declare… that the law-making power or the first and real effective source of law is the people or the body of citizens or the prevailing part of the people according to its election or its will expressed in general convention by vote, commanding or deciding that something be done or omitted in regard to human civil acts under penalty or temporal punishment….” (Marsilius of Padua, „Defensor Pacis“, AD 1324) -
Yeah, well you also think that Versailles created Hitler. That might even be irrelevant. It didn't stop us from killing your countrymen after Nuremburg.Originally posted by HershOstropoler
Well, we know what your last regime change in Iran created about 20 years later.Comment
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hi ,Originally posted by Urban Ranger
What silly people. That just means Iran will push ahead with the nuclear programme on double time.
till an f-15 arrives , ...... with Israeli airforce markings
have a nice day- RES NON VERBA - DE OPRESSO LIBER - VERITAS ET LIBERTAS - O TOLMON NIKA - SINE PARI - VIGLIA PRETIUM LIBERTAS - SI VIS PACEM , PARA BELLUM -
- LEGIO PATRIA NOSTRA - one shot , one kill - freedom exists only in a book - everything you always wanted to know about special forces - everything you always wanted to know about Israel - what Dabur does in his free time , ... - in french - “Become an anti-Semitic teacher for 5 Euro only.”
WHY DOES ISRAEL NEED A SECURITY FENCE --- join in an exceptional demo game > join here forum is now open ! - the new civ Conquest screenshots > go see them UPDATED 07.11.2003 ISRAEL > crisis or challenge ?Comment
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till an f-15 arrives , ...... with Israeli airforce markings
Unlike Iraq, the Irani nuclear problem is relatively decentralized. One strike against the reactor is not going to completely destroy their nuclear development capability.
The way to do it is to either use lots of missiles, and Israel isnt capable of it, take a huge risk by flying half of the IAF to various targets in Iran simultaneosly, or convince Uncle Sam to use his B-2 bombers.
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master" - Commissioner Pravin Lal.Comment
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Re: Iran - will we soon face another aggressive act?
That is bull****. Iran happens to be the most conservative country in the middle east right now. With the UAE scoring as the most progressive. Iran also has a legacy of treating women horribly and using shariah law more than other middle east countries. Also the conservative hardliners have shut down many reformist newspapers and offices.Originally posted by oedo
now the US is raising enmity on the most civilized and progressive country of the Middle East.
where will this all end?
So continue lying to yourself. Make yourself look really dumb in the end.
For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)Comment
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hi ,Originally posted by Eli
till an f-15 arrives , ...... with Israeli airforce markings
Unlike Iraq, the Irani nuclear problem is relatively decentralized. One strike against the reactor is not going to completely destroy their nuclear development capability.
The way to do it is to either use lots of missiles, and Israel isnt capable of it, take a huge risk by flying half of the IAF to various targets in Iran simultaneosly, or convince Uncle Sam to use his B-2 bombers.
we got more long range missiles to hit them then they have places to hide , ....
as for uncle sam , iran might better behave or they might get the same as afga and iraq , .....
as for the f-15's , they shall have upto date intel and hit the right place at the right time , .....
have a nice day- RES NON VERBA - DE OPRESSO LIBER - VERITAS ET LIBERTAS - O TOLMON NIKA - SINE PARI - VIGLIA PRETIUM LIBERTAS - SI VIS PACEM , PARA BELLUM -
- LEGIO PATRIA NOSTRA - one shot , one kill - freedom exists only in a book - everything you always wanted to know about special forces - everything you always wanted to know about Israel - what Dabur does in his free time , ... - in french - “Become an anti-Semitic teacher for 5 Euro only.”
WHY DOES ISRAEL NEED A SECURITY FENCE --- join in an exceptional demo game > join here forum is now open ! - the new civ Conquest screenshots > go see them UPDATED 07.11.2003 ISRAEL > crisis or challenge ?Comment
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and that would be its democracy
Roland: In the article that I cited a couple of weeks ago, they said Armitage said it was a democracy. That quote doesn't say Iran is a democracy by a long stretch.
the usual suspects: nuclear weapons and terrorism.
Odeo: Iran got caught on the terrorism and fessed up last week, trying to play it as one of those "well, they are in the lawless tribal areas". I don't know if this is true, but even if true, they have been playing awful coy on the issue. They have bin Laden's #2 in their territory and they are obligated to put the kaibash on him, no matter where he is located. If they can't control their own territory, then they ought not be surprised if they have M1A2s show up on their doorstep to control it for them.
Besides, like in Syria, the population isn't fundamentally opposed to the regime
Eh? The population certainly is fundamentally opposed to the mullahs--those who hold the real power.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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Re: Re: Iran - will we soon face another aggressive act?
hi ,Originally posted by Fez
That is bull****. Iran happens to be the most conservative country in the middle east right now. With the UAE scoring as the most progressive. Iran also has a legacy of treating women horribly and using shariah law more than other middle east countries. Also the conservative hardliners have shut down many reformist newspapers and offices.
So continue lying to yourself. Make yourself look really dumb in the end.
then why is it that every single day people flee to turkey , ..... people dont run when everything is going good , .....
have a nice day- RES NON VERBA - DE OPRESSO LIBER - VERITAS ET LIBERTAS - O TOLMON NIKA - SINE PARI - VIGLIA PRETIUM LIBERTAS - SI VIS PACEM , PARA BELLUM -
- LEGIO PATRIA NOSTRA - one shot , one kill - freedom exists only in a book - everything you always wanted to know about special forces - everything you always wanted to know about Israel - what Dabur does in his free time , ... - in french - “Become an anti-Semitic teacher for 5 Euro only.”
WHY DOES ISRAEL NEED A SECURITY FENCE --- join in an exceptional demo game > join here forum is now open ! - the new civ Conquest screenshots > go see them UPDATED 07.11.2003 ISRAEL > crisis or challenge ?Comment
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Yeh, the "most progressive" line brought a chuckle from me. The mullahs have been cracking down on colored head scarves in the last couple of weeks. Yeh, that's progressive.
I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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I meant, the chances to welcome the "regime changers" as liberators are much slimmer than in Iraq, because the regime doesn't use massive fear as a primary tool for its stability. The rather apathetic population could be easily turned into a radical anti-American, anti-invader crowd.Originally posted by DanS
Besides, like in Syria, the population isn't fundamentally opposed to the regime
Eh? The population certainly is fundamentally opposed to the mullahs--those who hold the real power."I have been reading up on the universe and have come to the conclusion that the universe is a good thing." -- Dissident
"I never had the need to have a boner." -- Dissident
"I have never cut off my penis when I was upset over a girl." -- DisComment
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because the regime doesn't use massive fear as a primary tool for its stability
That's not true. It's not a Stalinist police-state like Iraq, so it has different characteristics. But it does use massive fear.
The rather apathetic population could be easily turned into a radical anti-American, anti-invader crowd.
Did anybody suggest invading Iran? This is more a cell phone revolution type regime change. Think Serbia, not Iraq. Think $100 million, not $100 billion.
And I don't think they're apathetic at all.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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"this is how it started in Iraq as well one year ago. now the US is raising enmity on the most civilized and progressive country of the Middle East. "
We are rasing emnity, while they are supporting Al Qaeda!?
I don't see how you call Iran a civlized and progressive country. That country is still a well known supporter of terrorism(Hezbollah, etc.) and is still a theocracy.
"The days fo the Islamic republic as is are already numbered, due to purely Iranian developments. It will take many years, but change is inevitable."
Nothing is inevitable. All those who hold true power, the mullahs, are backed and supported by a lorge force with guns, and they believe enforcing Sharia on the country is the will of Allah. They have shown willingness to ignore democratic pressure before, even when Khatami was being elected by over 70%. Iran's mullahs will not go quietly.
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Eh? The population certainly is fundamentally opposed to the mullahs--those who hold the real power."
Correct, the people there would prefer a liberal state, not the current government in power."I'm moving to the Left" - Lancer
"I imagine the neighbors on your right are estatic." - SlowwhandComment
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Ph my god! I mena, Iranina women can vote, they can get university degrees, they can join politics and be elcted..but if they can't wear colored headgear, well, it murder!!Originally posted by DanS
Yeh, the "most progressive" line brought a chuckle from me. The mullahs have been cracking down on colored head scarves in the last couple of weeks. Yeh, that's progressive.
If we take women's rights as a sign or porgressiveness, the Iran is certainly better than say, Saudi Arabia, our biggest arms customer in the region.
When was the last time anyone here hear learn about "reformist" papers in any of the big US allies? Sure, the Ayahotollahs close the, but to close somehting means it must have had a chance to open, and many keep popping up and up. And Iran has had far more pratcie with elections in the last 20 years than the vast majority of Arab states, and not fraulent, staged elections, but elections were actual political parties not tied to the government can win.
Get the tersm right DanS: Ayahtollahs, not Mullahs.If you don't like reality, change it! me
"Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
"it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
"Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard ShawComment
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Gepap, they are mullahs too.
Iran lacks any progressive elements in almost all its institutions except the university, so don't try to give it any. It happens to be the university in Iran is the base of the reformist movement. Iran is one of the most conservative states at this time in the middle east. That is undeniable and is a fact.
You argument is bull.For there is [another] kind of violence, slower but just as deadly, destructive as the shot or the bomb in the night. This is the violence of institutions -- indifference, inaction, and decay. This is the violence that afflicts the poor, that poisons relations between men because their skin has different colors. - Bobby Kennedy (Mindless Menance of Violence)Comment
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The days fo the Islamic republic as is are already numbered, due to purely Iranian developments. It will take many years, but change is inevitable.
I agree with GePap on this. Or, more to the point, we don't know how long it will take, but perhaps years. However, the developments aren't purely Iranian, although mostly. Those who want to risk jail time can put up a dish and pull in monarchist and democratic channels from Los Angeles. As far as I can tell, this reaches upwards of 10-20% of the population. The internet is also connecting the Iranian diaspora in the West with those in-country.
If we take women's rights as a sign or porgressiveness, the Iran is certainly better than say, Saudi Arabia, our biggest arms customer in the region.
I agree. But does a favorable comparison to Saudi Arabia suddenly make you the most progressive country in the region? Puleeez.
and many keep popping up and up
From what I can tell, those papers do not keep popping up, god bless them. Most of the Iranian dissidents appear to be becoming dissillusioned by how little they have accomplished recently.
Get the tersm right DanS: Ayahtollahs, not Mullahs.
Mullahs is the right term as well. So piss off.
Last edited by DanS; May 25, 2003, 12:01.I came upon a barroom full of bad Salon pictures in which men with hats on the backs of their heads were wolfing food from a counter. It was the institution of the "free lunch" I had struck. You paid for a drink and got as much as you wanted to eat. For something less than a rupee a day a man can feed himself sumptuously in San Francisco, even though he be a bankrupt. Remember this if ever you are stranded in these parts. ~ Rudyard Kipling, 1891Comment
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