Team Info and Contacts - PAL

[ruff_hi]

yeah - I missed taking a screenshot of the early discussion in the chat box - didn't know it was deleted.

cres basically said that PAL thinks we are winning this game and they will not trade us philosophy for that reason.

Edit: I also said "bet Krill is killing himself laughing when he reads all of the threads"

[sunrise089]

I can't see why PAL thinks we're winning the game. They know they're ahead in tech and have weaker neighbors. I doubt our wonder RB epics/adventures records are making them loose any sleep. Perhaps he just said it to be flattering while rejecting our trade offer.

[Dreylin]

Well Ruff actually said that they thought we would win, not that we're winning now; and tbh it has been opined in these fora that we have a good chance....

I can see what Pal are saying; we have basically told them that it's a priority for us to get Philo, and if they're pulling back from Rabbits Eng really isn't overly useful to them. I can certainly see why they've made their decision ... even if I wish they hadn't!

[mostly-harmless]

In the light of IMperio having Engineering now, do we want to offer "our" Engineering to PAL for some other (cheaper) techs? Better than not to trade it at all.

mh

[T-hawk]

I doubt that'd work - I bet PAL already has a trade lined up with Imperio for Engineering and that's why they didn't want ours.

Also, what other techs do they have? Can't do Paper. It's a Liberalism prereq so PAL will nix it. And Paper opens up both Education and Printing Press which are higher priority for a Great Scientist than Philosophy so we lose the bulb capability.

[mostly-harmless]

Optics & Music are also available, iirc.

mh

[sooooo]

We could suggest optics I suppose. It stops them using the liberalism excuse.

[mostly-harmless]

Engineering is worth 1430b.
Optics is worth 858b.
Music is worth 858b.

Option 1 would be we give them Engineering for both techs (Music is pretty useless after the GA is gone).
Option 2 would be to give Engineering for Optics & cash (they have 377g in the bank).
I prefer Option 2.

Draft:

Hi PAL,
since you don't want to trade us any techs that lead to Liberalism (despite our guarantee not to race you to it) we offer you Engineering for Optics and XXX gold.
As you know we are facing an Imperio/Templars(/Rabbits) alliance (check out the F4 screen for active trades) we would like to see our civs working closer together.

TRB

I would ask for at least 300 gold, knowing they will haggle it down.

mh

[sunrise089]

That sounds fine, but we could also offer Engineering for Optics by itself and hope our offer is more lucrative than Imperio's.

[Kylearan]

I agree with sunrise.

[Zeviz]

I also agree. We should attach screenshot of F4 screen to our next email.

[mostly-harmless]

I'd rather have some money with it to be honest. The cash is more helpful short term than optics.

mh

[mostly-harmless]

Once we the war starts we should consider closing borders with PAL to prevent them to use our trade routes. Crescentfresh said they are currently getting 16gpt from us (which is doubtful as it should be a multiple of 3).
All it takes PAL is a map trade with either Imperio or Templar to have a route to our territory and getting trade routes to us.

I think we can reasonably argue that we think they have played an excellent opening and will win this game and would do likewise in our situation (see Philo embargo).

mh

[sunrise089]

Won't closed Imperio+Templar borders block PAL routes?

[mostly-harmless]

I don't think it works that way. PAL has opne borders with both Imperio and Templars. They also keep open borders to us.

If someone could confirm that, it would be helpful.

mh