Nicosar's Master Challenge

[Ming]

Re: *sigh*

Originally posted by TheFather
...

After reading every word in your latest post twice, I have put in quotes all that was worth reading.

Let's address facts since you seem to be ignoring them.

Did he get two free techs?

The save proves he did.

(now... assuming that did misunderstand, which is still in doubt.=)

Did he mention that fact to the other two players, or did it only come up when somebody checked the original save?

No, he didn't mention them... he just continued on and tried to take advantage of people who had agreed to play him a game.

A man of no honor.

Please feel free to address this post point by point.

[atawa]

Father's last 2000 words of wisdom

[Nicosar]

Listen men, I too am a writer, so perhaps sometimes I do get carried away with the pre-point 'excitement factor' mentioned by the father, and I only write to briefly (for real this time) say that I respect your desires to see proof and less talk, and so I will only in the future (the near future, at least until some solid credibility is established ) come here to post game results or talk about the conditions of an on-going game (though this, as you can imagine, will be much rarer), since I dont think anything else will be worthwhile to say, which I am stating more in agreement with you then anything else.

That Game? That strange and destiny-cursed little debacle of questionable talent on my part? It was what it was. As for the cheating, I assure you, with all honesty, no such thing happened INTENTIONALLY. If it did, it was absolutely a misunderstanding and inability to catch all words, nothing more. If you knew me, you'd know that there is not a more honorable person on the face of the earth, though you might giggle at this, and it would be shameful for such a person to dishonor himself in one of the few fields in which he considers himself at the top of his class, would it not? You can believe me, or not, but if I prove honest in the future I trust you will leave this incident as a fluke and nothing more.

Also, and the most important part of this before I leave you all (also for real this time) until game results need to be displayed, I will say this:

Do not bring up your real-life credentials concerning government, advertising, or even universities, since in my mind they are all evil, and i mean this with the highest and most emphatic sense of the word, being a devout ethicist who ponders the effects of even plucking a living leaf, and it does nothing but denote your attachment to these horrible earthly institutions which if you were truly wise would try to diminish as much as possible, despite the fact that we ALL must be subservient to them.
What you call 'modern government' and even democracy is but the latest form of power by which a select few control everyone, though in every epoch of civilization the current form of this is hailed as civilized but is soon obsoleted by better forms; advertising is perhaps the very essence of evil on earth, and emphatically so, (without disrespect to you Ming, who must to this for a living and not out of love, im sure) and universities merely feed these two awful institutions with new 'trained specialists'. I myself am a silicon graphics specialist (I still hate the word) and sat in the theater wacthing final fantasy the movie snickering to myself how they failed utterly to make it realistic and how it could be improved in very precise and technical ways, but I was not before prepared to say this.

I just want to end this point by saying that I think most of us are proffesional men, but that in the arena of civ, all of this is irrelevant.

-Nicosar the Gameplayer-

(on a side note, I have corrected some very minor graphical errors (indeed small, minor to be sure, but which needed ammending) and put the new CITIES and UNITS files in place of the old ones in the game folder of NICOSAR 1 in the dowloading site you may go to via the link in my first post)

[Theseus]

I've been watching this little lovefest, and the way Nico's last post scrolled on my screen I just saw the first paragraph (try it)...

I was like, "OK, good response, short and sweet, Nico will take a shot at earning crediblity (from a hole, I thought) through actions not words."

Then I scrolled further...

[Chris 62]

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing.
Depart, I say, and let us have done with you.
In the name of God, go!

[Ming]

Originally posted by Nicosar
If you knew me, you'd know that there is not a more honorable person on the face of the earth

Your silence at the beginning of the game when you realized you had two sciences speaks differently.

A man of honor would have mentioned it. You didn't.

What's even sadder is your continued defense that you did nothing wrong. You don't even see that what you did was wrong... You took advantage of people in a friendly game by not even mentioning you had an unfair advantage... sad... and no honor what so ever...

[Alexander's Horse]

Let's not be too hard on the newbie - maybe he didn't know free techs is a no, no.

He's trying hard to make friends, which is not easy when you believe you are a genius.

[HappySunShine]

But you see, it is not about the puppy, rather in a matter of speaking it is about the dog. The dog is not the puppy, you must understand this highly enlightening concept, for only then may you be able to comprehend the full depth of my post. Now let us think for a moment, if the dog is not the puppy, and the puppy is not the dog, then is it not safe to say that the puppy is not the dog and the dog is not the puppy? Fascinating! Do you not see it? Do you not see the many facets this my point has taken? Let us try another example.

The kitten is not the cat, the cat is not the kitten. This my friends is true strategy. This my friends is what I have come to preach to you and only through this understanding will you comprehend its depth. Now, lets compare the settings of civ 2 to the concept I have just discussed.

The giga map is not a small map. The small map is not a giga map. Do you understand now? It's simply smashing play! We can apply this to all aspects of civilization 2. The chariot is not a horseman. The horseman is not a chariot. This is where my true talent lies. But it is not any ordinary talent, it is a talent yet to be attained by the rest of you. Only through true understanding of this simple, yet incredibly deep concept will you master the game.

Now, I will tell you a story that will truly boggle your very basic thoughts on the game: The puppy was traveling through the city when it met the dog. (Stay with me now, this part gets a little complicated) The puppy stared at the dog for many hours. Finally it came to the conclusion it was not a dog. With this new found knowledge the puppy left the city never to return until one day it became a dog.

This is my genius. This is what you must compete against and I dare say that there isn't one of you who has that capability. I challenge all of you to a giga map (500X500) with 26 AI's. To make it a truly strategically challenging game we'll make the map 98% water. We will restart until I have 10 or more techs to start with and then, and only then, will we begin our epoch battle for supremacy.

-EyesOfNight the highly strategically adapatable and ingenious yet humble player of the most incredibly spectacular and indepth game ever created by Sid Meier the greatest computer developer of all time second to none other than Brian Reynolds-

[Ming]

HappySunShine

Congrats... That made more sense than any of the stuff TheFather or Nicosar has posted to date. And you even did it in less words...

BRAVO...

And I love Nicosar's latest tactic... "I did nothing wrong... I misunderstood... I have honor... oh and by the way, no disrespect, but look at all these things I consider evil...."



The guy cheats, and his concept of a defense is to say other people are evil, and he isn't...


Face it Nicosar... your silence at the beginning of the game is all the proof anybody needs that you have no honor. But then again, maybe you are lying, and you understood perfectly, and you are really just a cheater.

Let's see... the word of Atawa vs. yours... Not even close...

So do cheaters fall in your class of evil professions?

[TheFather]

good news

The turn to civility of this thread is encouraging, however little. Nicosar is a good guy. Remember, we had our own little run in when we first met upon the forums of CFC, and I have come to realize in a short time he truly loves this game. Perhaps I ran to his defense a bit hastily, with words and attitude not befitting a newbie on this forum, as you have so politely reminded me.

Ming, your points are well taken, but I still feel that there was no wrongdoing. I myself had NO idea that only the host had a chance to get free techs at the beginning. It was my understanding that depending on difficulty level everyone got 1, 2, or none.

Does this make me a nub? Perhaps, although my passion for this game would rival that of yourself, I am sure. Does being a nub or newbie make me deserving of insults and ridicule as Nicosar has received them for a slight stumble on his path to meeting and greeting this gracious group of persons? I think not.

I also don't recall coming here, as indicated, and claiming any throne of civiliation godship. And as for any references to that by Nicosar, it is just his personality and not meant to enrage the fires within you good people, I am sure.

I am still confused as to why his initial post was received as it was. Merely because of his claim of skill in civ? I would hope that those mere words were not enough to bring out the worst in this bunch, as they clearly have.

As for our professional backgrounds, why Chris 62 felt the need to provide this information escapes me. Would it matter if I were a successful civil rights/personal injury/medical malpractice attorney millionaire with a 100k car and 1.2 mill house? Of course not, so dont waste my time and I wont waste yours speaking of Section 1983 and Federal Civil Rights laws in an effort to somehow improve my position.

I will say your professions are interesting tho

Further, I find it interesting that you state I should EARN my respect yet does not the same hold true for you? And given the ridiculously antagonistic posts have you not lost respect? I speak to noone specifically here, but feel it is worth examining the positions the apparently old school members of this forum take.

Ming, to think you refer to the puppy post as making more sense than anyhting I have written to date does nothing more than continue the hostility. I would expect more from one of your apparent position in society, as others speak so highly of you. When will I see this great man who appears so clearly to others?

So who's up for a game?

[Ming]

Re: good news

Originally posted by TheFather
Ming, your points are well taken, but I still feel that there was no wrongdoing. I myself had NO idea that only the host had a chance to get free techs at the beginning. It was my understanding that depending on difficulty level everyone got 1, 2, or none.

Even most newbies know that.. and he claims he was a master... he knows. And if there was "nothing wrong" why didn't he mention it at the beginning of the game.? His silence speaks for him.

He is either a cheater, or has no honor... take your pick.

[Flatlander Fox]

I just want to end this point by saying that I think most of us are proffesional men, but that in the arena of civ, all of this is irrelevant.

I think you couldn't be more wrong.

Playing a game with so many loopholes like Civ DEMANDS that you play with people that have a little professionalism. It's very important that you can somewhat trust people when you invest 6 hours of your time into a game. My selection of people that I play seriously with is pretty limited, due to things like what happened with you and Atawa's game.

[Alexander's Horse]

Well I must admit I'm at some disadvantage in defending the guy since I'm not reading his posts

Way too long for me

But I would have thought if he was deliberately cheating he would have put a password on his civ or disguised it better in some other way.

[HappySunShine]

I'm a professional Troll.

[TheFather]

the high court of civ?

You are so quick to judge Ming. Why is it you care so much? He is either a cheater or has no honor? Where do you come up with this? Because he was a self-proclaimed master? So what, perhaps he lied, perhaps he doesnt play much MP, perhaps he just didnt know. Thats why he didnt mention it.So what?

Do you really care that much about what happened in game you didnt participate in? Perhaps you wont play him. You have made abundantly clear your position, not only here but you felt the need to visit the CFC forum and do the same, just in case some of us were not aware of that which you know, and that is Nicosar is a cheater. YELL IT LOUD FOR ALL THE WORLD TO HEAR AS MING HAS PASSED JUDGMENT ON HIS FELLOW MAN!

Your passion for this issue is disturbing.