The Distant Rumblings of War!

[curtsibling]

Nope, the D7 save can stay in the Dictator7 folder.

[Blue Lion]

Originally posted by curtsibling The StuG III evolves into the Hetzer, and then the Jagdpanther

The Jagdpanther appeared at the front prior to the Hetzer. Both were formidable weapons. But the Jagdpanther also was a beauty - something like a Ferrari amongst the tanks - and therefore also made a moral pushup to the troops (besides its very powerful 8,8 gun). A total number of 382 was produced by MIAG ( Mühlenbau und Industrie AG) in Brunswick.

[curtsibling]

Cheers for the info, BL!

I will have a look at the order of units this week.



Looking at the units, I am going to make a few changes...

I will have the Jagdpanther evolving from the Panzer III
and then later have the StuG III becoming the Hetzer...
I also plan to have the Panzer-IV becoming the Colian
in 1946...That will make an old unit useful again...!

[PietH]

What unit has the bigger firepower? If it's the Jagdpanther, I would suggest StuGIII -> jagdpanther and Panzer III -> Hetzer.

Btw, did you change the ability to build factories on urban terrain? In previous games, I could build factories all around Berlin, greatly increasing production. Now I get a notice telling me function is not possible.

[curtsibling]

What I might do with each unit is this:

StuG III -> Jagdtiger
Jagpanzer -> Jagdpanther
Panzer III -> StuG III
Panzer IV -> Colian
Panther- > Panther II
Tiger - > King Tiger
Marder -> Wespe -> Hummel

I might just drop the Hetzer. It is a nice tank hunter, but
the Jagdpanther does the job and more. Also the hetzer does
not really fit into any category with the earlier units...

I will make a new upgrade order for the units tonight.

PS
I will look into the terrain rules too and see if mining is
allowed on industry all year round. I recently made a change
to the urban terrain and it can no longer be mined...

[PietH]

Unit development looks good, except for the StuG III. It's in both the left and right column. Do you mean it will go from Panzer III -> StuGIII -> Jagdtiger? Does that mean the Stug III is not available at the start? For me it's the only ground unit with enough punch to attack a city. If should be starting line up.

[techumseh]

Shouldn't the main progression be from medium tank to medium tank, and from assault gun to assault gun?

The historical progression was: Pz II - Pz III - Pz IV - Pz V (Panther). No surprise there. For assault guns it was StuG III - JdPz IV - JdPz V. I'm not sure where the Hetzer fits in, exactly.

The Tigers (Pz VIa and Pz VIb) should be treated separately from the medium tanks.

What's a "Colian"?

[typhoon]

Originally posted by techumseh
What's a "Colian"?

http://members.tripod.com/~fingolfen/panther/panthcol.html

[fairline]

It was a panther with AA turret which fortunately didn't see service.

[techumseh]

Thanks. However, it doesn't seem reasonable to insert a flakpanzer into a progression of medium tanks.

[Blue Lion]

Originally posted by techumseh
I'm not sure where the Hetzer fits in, exactly.

As the Hetzer was developed by an demand of Guderian using the chassis of the Pz 38 (t) it would be another upgrade of that tank. The Hetzer was in overall one of the most sophisticated solutions in German tank design. So the Jagdpanther was better in nearly all categories, the Hetzer was much, much cheaper and also able to deal with nearly all enemy tanks.

[curtsibling]

The Colian is built on a medium tank chassis, though.

And Colians only appear in the last incarnation of units...
As a replacement to the venerable (in 1946) Panzer IV.

And that stage, it will be unlikely that the player will be
building Panzer IVs, given the plethora of better types.

[curtsibling]

Originally posted by PietH
Unit development looks good, except for the StuG III. It's in both the left and right column. Do you mean it will go from Panzer III -> StuGIII -> Jagdtiger? Does that mean the Stug III is not available at the start? For me it's the only ground unit with enough punch to attack a city. If should be starting line up.

Don't worry! The StuG is still where it is -

Later (around mid/late1944) when Jagdpanthers are available, the StuG is replaced by these, and the Panzer III is then made
in StuG IIIs. This brings an early war medium tank that is of decreasing effectiveness, back into life as good attack units.

I am going to get to work on a definitive workaround for this unit line-up right now.

[curtsibling]

Reviewing the situation...
I think I will keep the StuG III in it's usual slot. And have the Jagdpanzer IV become the Jagdpanther.

Question is - What to do with the Panzer III - By 1944, it is becoming outclassed...So what should it evolve into?

A tank hunter type like the Hetzer/StuG seems logical, but should it be replaced with a better tank type instead?

Any suggestions are welcome!

PS
Keep in mind the Panther and late war Panzer IVs are already in the unit list.

[curtsibling]

The solution I have came up with is this...

The StuG III will stay in it's slot for the whole scenario.
The Jadgpanzer will evolve to the Jadgpanther eventually...
The Panzer III upgrades into an SS Panther in late 1944...

I might leave out the Hetzer now, as the StuG fits that role.