Medieval Pack II: A Call to Arms

[WesW]

I forgot that when I changed the timeline to add more turns to the Ancient age that it would affect the enslaver disband trigger. Turn 400 now occurs at 1820, and this should be when the units are disbanded. If a civ has not discovered the obsoleting advance for a slaving unit by that turn, then they may be able to construct new units after 1820. I will ask Wouter about this.
Wouter, are you out there? I have not heard from you in a while.

[Dale]

Wouter doesn't seem to be here, but I am. I took a look at Wouter's code, and it doesn't appear to disable the slave-enabled units at turn 400. From how the code flows, it only kills currently active slave-enabled units.

A quick way to stop this that I can think of is in his code change the following line in the slavery Handler to:

From: if(g.year == 400) {
To: if(g.year > 399) {

This will kill any of the slave-enabled units the script detects from turn 400 onwards. However the pitfall is if the AI is not advanced enough yet, it'll end up with no units to defend or attack.

EDIT: This better for not stuffing up the window?

[Pintello]

Hi Wes,

If it were up to me I would just leave it the way it is. Like Dale warned, it could detrimentally hurt the AI if it is not sufficiently advanced. Also, allowing new slaving units to be created after the cutoff period if the civ still has the tech can be said to represent the slaving that still goes on in the modern world.

I read somewhere that in overall numbers, there is more slaving going on now than there was around the turn of the 19th century. People in the 21st century just don't use slaves for field labor any more, they use them for more nefarious purposes now.

Timothy Pintello

[Frog_Gamer]

Slaver trigger

this has happened to me aswell. The slaver units disappearred around 1827 or 6, instead of rigth on 1800. Funny

I have run the game on hard (ie no penalty on science), with a reduced tech tree (-20% of the original tech tree) and have found that finally I am on time the whole way thru

It is really in the early game that science is to expensive. I was even about to revert to original settings for the end game (2040) but this needs more testing

[StarGazer]

Slavers Code Trigger Not Working?

Originally posted by WesW
I forgot that when I changed the timeline to add more turns to the Ancient age that it would affect the enslaver disband trigger. Turn 400 now occurs at 1820, and this should be when the units are disbanded. If a civ has not discovered the obsoleting advance for a slaving unit by that turn, then they may be able to construct new units after 1820.

In my game, England's Zulu Warriors were still around in 1823 C.E. Also, England still has light and heavy cavalry units in 1873 C.E. I don't know whether these victory enslavement units will be able to make slaves now, though, since the Emancipation Act is in effect.

In any case, I know nothing of programming or codes, so I'll leave it to you experts to figure out how to correct things.

BTW, thanks to those of you who showed me how to quote correctly!

[janilxx]

AI1 and AI2 are in war. AI1 has his noble next to AI2's city. AI2 has many units next to that same city(and next to AI1's noble).

AI1's noble tries to establish embassy every turn(stupid because they are in war).

AI2 does not kill AI1's noble(stupid because they are in war).

[WesW]

Large civs version posted !

Here is a paste of the Readme. Note that you must have the regular version of the mod installed in addition to the Large files.
I looked at the Large civs version of the Medpack I to get an idea of which files needed to be changed. This version is actually simpler than that for the Medpack I. I hope that I did not forget anything.

Large Civs Readme for the Medieval Pack II
By Wes Whitaker

This file describes the general changes made to text files to better suit playing games with large civs (I consider "large" to generally mean 15 or so cities in the initial expansion phase of the game). There should be enough room for about twice this many cities for each civ if all decent land city sites are counted.

Const:
The time given to the AI to take their turns raised by 40%.
The terrain "box" that is used to place ruins raised from 6x6 to 8x7. This means there there will be only about two-thirds as many ruins on a given map as there were previously.
The amount of pollution a civ has to produce to result in anarchy raised from 2,500 to 3,500.
The level at which an eco-pact is broken raised from 200 to 300.

Pollution:
I raised the threshold for disasters on large and huge maps by about 50%.

Govern:
I raised the too many cities threshold and the war discontent max units by 50%, and reduced the penalty for violating the city limit by about 33%.
I lowered the science coefficients for all governments except Tyranny.

Terrain:
I reduced movement costs by about 33%.


I guess that I will leave the slaver disband code alone right now. If a civ has not gotten Flintlock by 1820, I guess they need some slavery to help them out. Funny about the weird disbanding years, though.
Dale, would you delete the code you posted? It is messing up the page width, at least for me. Thanks for the effort, though.

Jani, I have seen what you are reporting. I think it happens when the AIs have regained better feelings towards one another, but have not gotten around to signing a cease-fire. At least I hope this is what is happening.

[Dale]

Hey Wes, you running at 640 * 480? I have no problems with anyone's code at 800 * whatever. Anyways, I fixed it for you.

[Jules]

Originally posted by jackazzstudent
I've encountered another small bug. When wonders such as the temple of karnak and aristotle's become obsolete, the shrine and academy do not appear for building in the queue. It doesn't seem to be able to "take away" the benefits of the wonder.

Adam

Hi, guys! I'm new to the forums, and very impressed by Wes's Med Mod II. I've been working on a solution to the problem posed in the quote above from Adam. The issue he raises is easily corrected by changing Wouter's SLIC code for wonders so that the free improvements granted by wonders can be built again once those wonders expire. The problem, I think, runs much deeper than that however. For example, with Aristotle's Lyceum, the discovery of Public Education should be accompanied by a drop in the civ's science as the Lyceum expires. Unfortunately this is not happening. The game doesn't seem to be able to "turn off" the free building benefit when the wonder's obsoleting advance is discovered (although it is when the city is captured or destroyed). But I think I've figured out a way to use SLIC to remedy this. Below is documentation I've prepared to accompany the bug fix. Feel free to read on if you're interested....


THE PROBLEM

A number of wonders in Med Mod II grant a free building in each of the player's
cities. For example, building Stonehenge gives a Granary in every city. The
problem arises when the wonder is supposed to expire. What happens is that
although the wonder has expired, the benefit has not. So in the case of
Stonehenge it's as if the Granary is still there--food production does not
suddenly drop off after discovering Railroad. This defeats the purpose of
having these wonders expire in the first place. Here are the wonders affected
by this bug:

Aristotle's Lyceum (free Academy) - expires with Public Education
Chichen Itza (free Courthouse) - expires with Neural Reprogramming
Drug Rehab Act (free Prison) - expires with AI Surveillance
Stonehenge (free Granary) - expires with Railroad
Temple of Karnak (free Shrine) - expires with Steam Engine
Ramayana (free Theater) - expires with Electrification
Great Wall (free City Walls) - expires with Military Engineering

This is only a problem when wonders expire. Wonders granting a free improvement
that never expire (obviously) do not have this problem.


MY SOLUTION (not yet completely tested)

In the case of the seven wonders listed above, I have created a set of "anti"
buildings, each corresponding to the building granted by the particular
wonder. An "anti" building does exactly the opposite of the building it
corresponds to. So, an anti-Academy (Aristotle's Lyceum Society in the game)
reduces the city's science by 30%, whereas the Academy adds 30% science. When
a civ possesses a certain wonder and then discovers its obsoleting advance, the
corresponding "anti" building is automatically created in every city to exactly
offset that wonder's benefit. Specifically in SLIC, at the beginning of a city's
turn, a check is made to see if the city owner: 1) possesses the wonder,
2) possesses the advance that obsoletes it, and 3) the city does not already have
the "anti" building in it. If all three conditions are satisfied, the "anti"
building is automatically built. This is done at the beginning of every city's
turn, so you can't cheat by selling off the "anti" building. If you do, it'll
just come right back next turn. In principle you could retain the wonder's
benefit indefinitely by selling off the "anti" building every single turn, but
if you're managing an empire of 50+ cities, I think you have better things to
do with your time!

In the case of cities being destroyed or changing hands, an additional check is
made to determine whether or not an "anti" building exists even if the city
owner doesn't have the wonder it corresponds to. If it's there, it's automatically
destroyed.

Another issue is that the same building can't exist in a city twice. The wonders
Stonehenge, Temple of Karnak, and Ramayana permit their associated building to be
built after they expire (Granary, Shrine, and Theater respectively) since those
three improvements never go obsolete. But, in the case of Stonehenge for example,
the free Granary is still there even after discovering Railroad. You can rebuild
the Granary, but it won't give any extra food because there's a Granary already
present so to speak. Plus, the Food Silo building requires a Granary to be present
first before one can be built. But notice that after discovering Railroad you can
go right ahead and build Food Silos even though in principle you must have Granaries
first.

In dealing with this, I first modified Wouter's SLIC code for wonders so that
Shrines and Theaters can be built once Temple of Karnak and Ramayana, respectively,
expire. Secondly, I changed the above SLIC procedure as follows, using Ramayana
as an example: 1) the city owner possesses Ramayana, 2) the city owner possesses
Electrification, 2a) the city *does not* already have a Theater present (*not* the
freebie accompanying Ramayana--an actual Theater existing in the city inventory),
3) the city *does not* already have an anti-Theater present (called Ramayana
Reenactment Club). If condition 2a) is not satisfied (meaning there's a Theater
in the inventory) a check will be made to determine if an anti-Theater is present.
If one is, it will automatically be destroyed. That way, if Ramayana has expired
and the city later builds a Theater, there will be an increase in the city's
happiness from buildings.

Dealing with the second part of this issue (e.g., being able to build Food Silos
before Granaries when Stonehenge expires) required further modification to Wouter's
SLIC code for wonders. For example, a city must have a Shrine before it can build
a Basilica or Theater. Now, when a civ has Temple of Karnak and discovers Steam
Engine, a check is made to see if the city has a Shrine. If not, the city cannot
build a Basilica or Theater. A similar check is made for every building which
requires either a Granary, Shrine, or Theater (fortunately not too many!).

I also modified Wouter's SLIC code for wonders so that the "anti" buildings can
never actually be built by anyone. Finally I've given the "anti" buildings
sentimental titles (Stonehenge Cult for anti-Granary, for example), reflecting the
fact that even after a wonder is no longer useful there will always be those who
gather together around a memorial or some kind of social club out of a sense of
nostalgia to celebrate their nation's great achievements.

Aristotle's Lyceum Society (anti-Academy)
Chichen Itza Foundation (anti-Courthouse)
Drug Rehab Act Memorial (anti-Prison)
Stonehenge Cult (anti-Granary)
Temple of Karnak Cult (anti-Shrine)
Ramayana Reenactment Club (anti-Theater)
Great Wall Memorial (anti-City Walls)

Feel free to suggest alternative names for these buildings. These are only
preliminary, as I'm still testing.

Miscellaneous Changes: Courthouses now expire with Neural Reprogramming (same as
Chichen Itza) rather than with Criminal Code. You now need a University to build a
Publishing House instead of an Academy. I figured any city that never built an
Academy before Public Education (or was founded after Public Education) would be
screwed as far as science buildings go, not being able to build Publishing Houses
nor Public Schools (which require Publishing Houses).

Note: There appears to be an internal limit to the number of buildings allowed
by the game. If you have more than 64 improvements in the "buildings.txt" file,
those past the 64th entry are just ignored when used in gameplay. They do appear
in the build lists and scenario editor, and you can build them normally (you'll
even get a "building complete" message), but they won't appear in the city
inventory and you'll derive no benefits/costs from them. I discovered this when
testing out a solution slightly different than the one presented here involving
more than 64 improvements. I couldn't figure out why one of my buildings wasn't
being created when all the others worked fine, until I noticed that the building
in question was right at the end of "buildings.txt". I wrote a test SLIC file to
create improvements through the last entry of "buildings.txt" starting from one I
knew worked. Those past 64 weren't created; those up to and including the 64th
one were created. Fortunately Med Mod II has 57 buildings and my fix adds
another 7, for a total of 64 (just at the limit!).


I know some of this has been rendered moot by Wes's latest text update, where Karnak and Ramayana now no longer expire. Personally I preferred those wonders the way they were, and now with my modification they can expire and lose their benefit, and you'll have to rebuild your Shrines and Theaters.

So whaddaya think? Anybody interested?

[Rhuarc]

Wow Jules!! I must say taht I am impressed!! You really put some time into this one didn't !?! Well, I like it, but I am not one of the modders on here so I wouldn't know how it will affect the gameplay. You'll have to be sure and get the feedback of WesW for that one. But it sounds like an awesome idea though! and from the sounds of things you wil really be an asset to the forum and all the players here judging from your knwledge! Welcome!

[Locutus]

Wes,
I haven't played in a while but it seems you (and the others, esp. Dale) haven't been sitting still in the time I was gone, some of these changes look very interesting. It seems I'll have no choice but to play CtP2 all weekend to catch up

Wes/Dale,
This code-layout sh*t was already a problem with UBB, I had hoped vB would solve it but apparently not. The problem is that it looks different for everyone, for some people it looks okay, for others it's all screwed up. The only solution is to keep SLIC code that you post here as 'narrow' as possible or, better yet, attach it as a file rather than posting it directly. I specifically asked Markos to allow *.slc files to be attached so we'd better make use of it every now and then

Jules,
I only read through your post superficially (I have a lot of catching up to do, so I don't have much time at the moment) but it sounds like you put in a lot of effort in that and it looks very impressive However, wouldn't it be easier to just use the DestroyWonder event to kill the relevant wonder at the right moment? That should pretty much have the same effect as capturing or destroying a city. Just an idea, I didn't test it yet or anything.

[WesW]

I would like for a couple of people to verify the bug that Jules describes before we get into trying to fix it. It just seems weird that someone new to the mod would notice something that none of the veteran players have noticed. I have had people write me about the food shortage they suffered after getting Railroad when they had Stonehenge, for example.
It should be easy to check, just give yourself one of the wonders, and then give yourself the obsoleting advance a turn or two later. Check your science output, for example, with the wonder and then after the wonder expires.
I would check myself, but I have not started a game since the two new wonders were added a couple of weeks ago.

[Locutus]

Wes,
It's a good idea to test it out, I did some testing when I made those triggers and didn't notice anything odd back then. However, I have found that giving yourself things through the cheat menu can have some unexpected consequences, esp. when SLIC code is involved, so it may not be wise to test it so 'directly' through the cheat menu. You can probably safely test it by by giving yourself enough gold to rush-buy the wonder and by cheating your way to all prerequisites of the obsoleting advance but it would be best to actually research the advance itself 'manually'.

[Frog_Gamer]

Testing Jules Comments

I am currently in a game where I have 3 of the afore mentionned wonders. I will test tonigth and report later on what happens!

[Locutus]

That would be great, Frog_Gamer.
BTW Wes, just dawned to me: weren't you considering to add BleuO's city expansion mod to the MedMod a while back? I think that would be a great addition, why did it never come to that?

Edit: another (minor) issue: in the last version of the mod I played, the Egyptians were the only civ with a Pyramid city style while this style is by far the best-looking of all. Couldn't you add it to some other African nations too? I already did this myself for my own game but I'd have to have to redo it everytime you bring out a new version... (I know, I'm a lazy bastard )