Apolyton Fantasy Football

[Al B. Sure!]

Wow. Marc Mariani, Eric Weems, and Stefan Logan, three guys who did nothing offensively, were 100+ point fantasy players! Wow.

[Ben Kenobi]

Now look at RBs like Tomlinson and Fred Jackson last year.

[Al B. Sure!]

Insanity. Amendola was #14 among all RB's and WR's. Insane.

[Ben Kenobi]

Now the pick doesn't look so wild, does it? That would have been 14th best non QB with pick number 40. I'd have been justified drafting him in the 2nd.

[-Jrabbit]

I maintain that it was still a premature pick, since the NFL nerfed KO returns with the rule change.

[MRT144]

I'd argue that you should break out return men as their own position rather than give them the benefit of being WR replacements.

[-Jrabbit]

That's not an option at Yahoo.

It also provides huge bonus value to DBs. Sadly, not a lot of that happening this year.

[Jaguar]

I believe that the IDP/FFZ return yardage settings are bad, and fully agree with Albie. I still make my decisions with them in mind. (I *drafted* Amendola last year, even.)

I'm considering bringing back return yardage points in D/ST, but only at a rate of 100 yards per point or so. When a return man brings a kickoff from the 0 to his own 25, that's not worth 1.25 points. That's essentially an entirely neutral play. I'm comfortable with scoring it very slightly, but that's it.

[Ben Kenobi]

I maintain that it was still a premature pick, since the NFL nerfed KO returns with the rule change.

Cribbs is doing well. Premature or no, the good return men are rosterable. That's what I like about the Poly IDP system.

[-Jrabbit]

No points for return yardage unless it's a TD is equally unrealistic IMHO.

[Jaguar]

No, it's not. Talk to me when IDP/FFZ standards no longer have Danny Amendola as the 2nd-ranked scorer of 2010.

I drafted him in the 19th round of your draft last year; or rather, I drafted a magical button that gets me 1 point every time someone scored on the Rams, and I steamrolled your league with it. Am I proud of that? Not really. My draft moves are automatic, machine-like, and geared towards nothing but maximizing expected points.

But I'd prefer the game to be fun. And to me, that doesn't mean puzzling over whether Rivera wants to use Mike Goodson or Armanti Edwards as a kick returner.

One of the few saving graces of the NFL rule change is that it's making the IDP/FFZ rules less obviously broken.

[MRT144]

There are a few things that don't make sense about weighting it that heavily

a return of 20 yards from 5 yards in the end zone is rewarded despite putting the team in worse position than a touchback.

a 20 yard return from 5 yards deep in the endzone is worth more points than a 15 yard rush from the 5 yard line despite worse field position.

there is no potential league wide reciprocal benefit of return yards; QBs benefit their own and one other position on a complete pass. Touchdowns by one player benefit another player's kicker. Running backs are the only position without an obvious reciprocal benefit, except that the ratio of Rushing to Recieving Yards for RBs last year was 7:1 and Attempts 12:1 (for top 42 RBs). What return yards at that rate do is create just another running back type position in another position slot without any reciprocal benefit. And for Kick returners that also get touches on set downs, they're essentially untouchable bonus points.

A kickoff/punt return is essentially an infrequent (average 4 kickoff returns per team per game and 2.2 punt returns per game) low risk free play that has to happen at least once per game but it's rewards and risks are treated as if it is a play from scrimmage (the average gain per kickoff was 22.3 and 9.6 per punt), numbers that are way above yards per rush or passing attempt . A 20 yard from the 10 is equal to a 20 yard pass from the 10 despite there being a higher risk of turnover on the pass and a greater rewards for of creating further scoring opportunities for people on the field.

Finally there doesn't seem to be an imperative to count return yards in such a way except for the benefit of CB returners in the league while skewing offensive strategy from anything coherent.

[Al B. Sure!]

Amendola being the #2 WR of 2010 is troubling.

[Ben Kenobi]

No, it's not. Talk to me when IDP/FFZ standards no longer have Danny Amendola as the 2nd-ranked scorer of 2010.

Wow, I thought it was a brilliant pick.

I drafted him in the 19th round of your draft last year; or rather, I drafted a magical button that gets me 1 point every time someone scored on the Rams, and I steamrolled your league with it. Am I proud of that? Not really. My draft moves are automatic, machine-like, and geared towards nothing but maximizing expected points.

Why shouldn't you be proud of it? The rest of us had the exact same information that you did. Only you took advantage of it.

But I'd prefer the game to be fun. And to me, that doesn't mean puzzling over whether Rivera wants to use Mike Goodson or Armanti Edwards as a kick returner.

Really? Ok. I'm surprised you feel that way.

[-Jrabbit]

For a little perspective: In the five or so years of the IDP League, there has been not one mention or complaint about this setting.