NHL Playoffs

[Asher]

Which is why netminders like Jim Carey have a Vezina. Fact of the matter is that Luongo has a Vezina-equivalent.

So very pathetic...

[Asher]

Ben, if you value the Jennings so high...does the fact that Kiprusoff holds the all-time NHL record for lowest GAA in a season mean he's a lock for the HOF?

Not only did he win the Jennings, he smashed records doing so. Something even Luongo, inarguably the best goalie of all time, cannot claim?

[Asher]

The Jennings counts as hardware, so yes he's got hardware.

[Guynemer]

Also was Hasek pulled repeatedly in his prime and not started? Which series in what year ? My recollection (probably faulty) is that when he was pulled there were usually injury concerns.

He was pulled in 2008 in favor of Osgood, but I don't think many would argue that Hasek was still in his prime.

[Ben Kenobi]

Ben, if you value the Jennings so high...does the fact that Kiprusoff holds the all-time NHL record for lowest GAA in a season mean he's a lock for the HOF?

Does he have 300 wins? No.

Does he have 50 shutouts? No.

Does he have a winning playoff record? No.

I have a personal rule that you have to have more playoff wins than Kirk McLean to be a HOF candidate. That excludes Kippersoft.

[Asher]

Does he have 300 wins? No.

Does he have 50 shutouts? No.

Does he have a winning playoff record? No.

Do you not comprehend how arbitrary and stupid you are being?

"Jennings is important! Except when someone else wins it, sets an all-time NHL record doing it, and does it more than once!!"

If we keep going down this road, we're going to end up with you going "Ah, but was he 32 when he played his first SCF!? And does he have a 4 inch **** and a propensity to fall over when someone breathes on him?! And does he whine to the ref with such regularity that it is a running joke? All of these are factors, which is why Luongo is a Top 5 goaltender of all time."

[Asher]

Long story short: You don't get to the HOF because you were frequently almost one of the top goaltenders of the season. Not in the modern era.

You're certainly not one of the top goalies of all time.

Really, if Luongo has so many wins (which you keep bragging about), but can't convert those to cups...he deserves to be in the HOF, but not for the reasons you believe.

[-Jrabbit]

But it's a significant boost.

I agree that it's a boost, but not to the degree you seem to feel it is. Seems like you're refusing to acknowledge the warts, like being pulled in so many games, like not being started in a Game 6. While Luongo went deep and showed he can win a Game 7, the simple fact is that the Canucks should never have been in a G7 after blitzing to a 3-0 lead vs the Hawks. Similarly, you focus heavily on the 3 excellent home games he played, but seem blind to the extreme level of fail he showed in Boston (not to mention SCF G7 at home).

So yeah, it's the best playoff run he's had, but he was his own worst enemy along the way. Because when he's bad, he's really bad. Are people wrong to count those glaring flaws against him? I think not.

[Ben Kenobi]

I agree that it's a boost, but not to the degree you seem to feel it is.

Looking at resumes, how does he stack against Vanbiesbrouck? He's really the only comp, and Luongo is just a flat out better goaltender.

Seems like you're refusing to acknowledge the warts, like being pulled in so many games, like not being started in a Game 6.

I don't think they are as significant as 15 wins and 4 shutouts over the course of a playoff run. That's 6th all time, btw, only 5 have ever done better. He's had consistant playoff success, has a winning record in the playoffs. Ranked 38th now for playoff wins, which is low, but certainly better than where he was at previous. Better than Mike Luit Fr'instance, but not up to HOF calibre.

While Luongo went deep and showed he can win a Game 7, the simple fact is that the Canucks should never have been in a G7 after blitzing to a 3-0 lead vs the Hawks. Similarly, you focus heavily on the 3 excellent home games he played, but seem blind to the extreme level of fail he showed in Boston (not to mention SCF G7 at home).

I'm focussing more on the -13 for Christian Ehrhoff. That seems to me a more significant stat.

[Asher]

Luongo isn't going to have your ****ing baby. Give up already.

[Ben Kenobi]

Long story short: You don't get to the HOF because you were frequently almost one of the top goaltenders of the season. Not in the modern era.

You do if you're the best goalie born in the years from 1977-1982.

[Asher]

So, shocker, Luongo didn't win the Vezina. He did win the JENNINGS THOUGH!!!!!



I just realized, Thomas had 2.00 GAA and Luongo had 2.11 GAA. Luongo go the Jennings because it's a team award. Only reason Thomas didn't win it is because "the other" Boston goalie wasn't nearly as good. Once again, proving that the Jennings award doesn't mean much.

[Ben Kenobi]

I just realized, Thomas had 2.00 GAA and Luongo had 2.11 GAA. Luongo go the Jennings because it's a team award. Only reason Thomas didn't win it is because "the other" Boston goalie wasn't nearly as good. Once again, proving that the Jennings award doesn't mean much.

All Vezina winners prior to 1979 would be Jennings winners today. So the Jennings is actually the Vezina.

Kesler took home the Selke.

[Asher]

All Vezina winners prior to 1979 would be Jennings winners today. So the Jennings is actually the Vezina.

So Kiprusoff has two Vezinas then.

[Ben Kenobi]

So Kiprusoff has two Vezinas then.

They should just rename the Vezina. Call the Jennings the Vezina and the Vezina the Jennings.