Support For Same Sex Marriage Grows

[Q Classic]

Slowed, sure, but the west has declined.

Are we talking about population growth rates?

Because if we are, Japan and South Korea are actually growing slower than the bulk of Western and Central Europe.

[Ben Kenobi]

It also says that wives should be obedient, but doesn't suggest that husbands should necessarily be.

It says that husbands should love their wives and die for them, but it doesn't say that wives should do the same.

But face it, women really are inferior. After all, if they weren't, then our Christian Founding Fathers, wise as they were, would have given them the vote.

Like they did in 18th century China?

They also didn't give the vote to black people either. Is that because the bible said that black people were inferior to white people? Same with poor white people. Does the bible say that the franchise should be given to the rich only.

Better yet, what does the bible say about one man, one vote?

Nice strawman. No, really. It's like you took my satirical argument at face value, and then ran with it.

I'm having fun. How about you?

[Q Classic]

I see what you're talking about, it's the growth of innovation.

Actually, no, KH is more correct on SKorea and Japan's economic growth. It's slower now, because incremental growth is now more expensive.

[Q Classic]

It says that husbands should love their wives and die for them, but it doesn't say that wives should do the same.

Well, yes. Because a woman's life is worth less, and so the sacrifice is meaningless.

Like they did in 18th century China?

What does China have to do with this? Besides, they're un-American, and those ***-lovers* already discussing some form of gay marriage.

They also didn't give the vote to black people either. Is that because the bible said that black people were inferior to white people? Same with poor white people. Does the bible say that the franchise should be given to the rich only.

Well, I'm not making judgements on the Christian Founding Fathers who set up the system.

Since really, we're a Christian nation. And I'm not without sin, so I can't cast the first stone.

Better yet, what does the bible say about one man, one vote?

If it was good enough for our smart Founding Fathers, it's good enough for us today.

I'm having fun. How about you?

I'm having fun because I'm not actually arguing. I'm making **** up that sounds ridiculous.

Y'know, the Colbert thing.


*Of course, by this I only mean that China has one of the higher rates of cigarette smoking in the world.

[KrazyHorse]

Society has a vested interest in lowering the cost if it wishes to survive.

Why? Fertility rates are a bit below replacement levels in most industrialized countries, but not particularly far below. At current rates, with no immigration the industrialized world's population would drop by ~1/2 over the course of a century or so. And there is every evidence that outside the US the industrialized world's birthrate is slowly increasing from its former lows. Currently the only places in the world with what I would consider to be crisis birthrates are former Eastern Bloc nations, Japan and SK.

Mediterranean countries come next, while Northwestern Europe is actually not far from replacement rates at all.

Your sad obsession with having white people form a larger percentage of the world's population is ridiculous.

[Ben Kenobi]

Are we talking about population growth rates?

Output, population x GDP/capita.

Because if we are, Japan and South Korea are actually growing slower than the bulk of Western and Central Europe.

Not when you take GDP into consideration.

Actually to be fair, Eastern Europe and the former USSR have done even worse. They used to have 10 percent of the total world output in 1950, and are now down to around 2 percent, which is actually lower then they were before the industrial age.

[Ben Kenobi]

Why? Fertility rates are a bit below replacement levels in most industrialized countries, but not particularly far below.

Have you looked at them recently? We are seeing numbers lower then 1.5

That's very, very much lower then replacement.

At current rates, with no immigration the industrialized world's population would drop by ~1/2 over the course of a century or so. And there is every evidence that outside the US the industrialized world's birthrate is slowly increasing from its former lows. Currently the only places in the world with what I would consider to be crisis birthrates are former Eastern Bloc nations.

Your sad obsession with having white people form a larger percentage of the world's population is ridiculous.

I don't see why crisis birthrates are any less a problem for Japan and China.

My opposition is to liberalism, wherever it cripples societies. That other nations are swallowing western medicine is going to be apparent with the social upheaval we have coming up.

I could just have easily used eastern europe or russia, but I wanted to hit a bit closer home.

[KrazyHorse]

Have you done any research in this? Worldwide fertility rates are already at about 2.4, which is a rate not see in the western world until the 1970s, again coinciding with those demographic changes I was talking about. True, the rest of the world is slightly higher, but not by that much, even if you exclude western europe.

The rest of the world is slowly dropping down to reasonable fertility levels. That's a good thing. There was a demographic EXPLOSION in much of the undeveloped world when modern medicine and hygiene hit them for the first time. And UNLIKE the developed world their economies were NOT able to deal with it because THEIR economies were set up on the lines of labor-intensive agriculture. And they had only so much land. Which is PART of the reason Africa regressed for much of the 20th century. They're only now starting to grow.

Slowed, sure, but the west has declined.

Errr. No. You ******. The growth of the West continues.

And in fact, the growth of the West has been higher for a while than the growth of Japan. Unsure as to SK (Note that SK is still somewhat behind Western Europe and significantly behind the US, while Japan is at the level of Western Europe)

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.

[KrazyHorse]

To a certain extent yes. All that will mean is that the same problems afflicting Europe will simply be worldwide, which is a not very appealing notion.

The rest of the world (outside NA, Japan, SK and a select few others) should be so LUCKY as to have Europe's problems.

[KrazyHorse]

The world of the 60's saw fit to launch an exploration of the moon, something which we've not replicated since. Where's all the space exploration we were supposed to have by now?

Is this supposed to pass as an argument? We haven't been dropping tens (hundreds?) of billions of dollars into something as wasteful as trotting a dozen people around on the moon?

[KrazyHorse]

Have you looked at them recently? We are seeing numbers lower then 1.5

Can you read and perform exponential decay calculations? You gimp.

First off, Northwestern Europe has fertility rates ranging from 1.7-1.9 or so.

Mediterranean Europe and former Eastern Bloc countries are the only places where they're below that in Europe.

And outside Japan and SK industrialized countries have had INCREASING fertility rates recently.

GOD, you're retarded.

I ALREADY WROTE ALL THIS. You GIMP.

[KrazyHorse]

No. You, again are assuming that economics is a zero sum game. I don't see why the folks in China could not have the same standard of living they do now, while Europe maintained the same rate of growth they have had for centuries. That I see preferable to Europe stagnating.

You ****ING ******.

Europe has INCREASED its citizens' welfare FASTER in the last century than EVER BEFORE.

[KrazyHorse]

How many times do I have to tell you that before it sinks into the piece of detritus that passes for your brain?

[Ben Kenobi]

Can you read and perform exponential decay calculations?

Easily.

First off, Northwestern Europe has fertility rates ranging from 1.7-1.9 or so.

If you exclude Germany and include Norway in 'Northwestern Europe'.

Mediterranean Europe

Portugal, Spain and Italy are Western Europe, are they not?

And outside Japan and SK industrialized countries have had INCREASING fertility rates recently.

France, is about the only one.

[KrazyHorse]

I don't see why crisis birthrates are any less a problem for Japan and China.

Why the **** would you aggregate Japan and China? They're in two wholly different categories.

Despite China's growth it's STILL not close to fully industrialized.