Irish Marriage Equality Referendum Draws Near

[loinburger]

Here's the $24,000 question: how much of your day is spent in anger and/or hate? Because your behavior on here is nothing but hating / being angry with homosexuals, blacks, Muslims, liberals, Protestants, atheists, etc. (oh, also being angry when somebody starts a tribute thread ahead of you). If you're not like this in real life, then good for you, and we would all appreciate it if your online persona better reflected your real-life persona. If you're really this vengeful in real life then you're pitiful.

[Ben Kenobi]

Here's the $24,000 question: how much of your day is spent in anger and/or hate?

Better question - why do you hate Catholicism? What has it done to you to make you get so angry with it?

Because your behavior on here is nothing but hating / being angry with homosexuals, blacks, Muslims, liberals, Protestants, atheists, etc. (oh, also being angry when somebody starts a tribute thread ahead of you). If you're not like this in real life, then good for you, and we would all appreciate it if your online persona better reflected your real-life persona. If you're really this vengeful in real life then you're pitiful.

Wow. You bring up something from years ago that you've still not gotten over. Really, you're more obsessed with my actions than I am.

Let's see, how was my day yesterday.

I worked early yesterday on my book, about 4 hours or so. Ate, and fell asleep. Had a really good sleep. Got up, ate, wandered about for a bit. Chatted with a friend in Edmonton I'd not spoken to for awhile and got caught up with them and their life.

Decided I'd spamme with Polytubbies. I had planned to go out with friends, but they cancelled and rescheduled for Sunday. Spammed poly, watched some youtube videos. Watched some tennis. Fed's doing great this year. Then about 10pm I decided I'd put an early morning in working on my book. Put in a solid 6 hours.

Then I had a nap, went to mass - visited with friends.

Then I decide it's time to spamme Poly while waiting for an appointment. Friends show up at 2, hang out with them for a couple of hours. I want to take the rest of the day off, so I'll spamme a bit and then work on my AAR, or go play some games. Still haven't decided what to do for dinner.

That's a day in the life of Kenobi.

Monday is catching up on yardwork.

It's nice to be off on vacation.

[loinburger]

Better question - why do you hate Catholicism? What has it done to you to make you get so angry with it?

You are not the world's official spokesman for Catholicism.

You are not the world's greatest and most knowledgeable Catholic.

You are not the Pope, nor are you a Cardinal, Bishop, priest, or even a deacon.

You are not representative of all Catholics or of Catholicism.

Are you getting the picture, you narcissistic nutjob? I have known many Catholics in the course of my lifetime, and most of them were moral and honest people - my immediate family are all Catholic, but they "tolerate" my atheism and I "tolerate" their Catholicism because we all recognize that it's the morals of the other person that matter far more than their faith or lack thereof. I believe that the Catholic church has made many mistakes, but I am hopeful that they will continue to be acknowledged and rectified. The fact that I find you loathsome and that many others find you loathsome DOES NOT MEAN that we find all Catholics or Catholicism loathsome, BECAUSE YOU ARE NOT REPRESENTATIVE OF ALL CATHOLICS! You appointed yourself to this position soon after your conversion, and due to your lack of knowledge and your abysmal morals you are horribly unqualified for this task. If you were a Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Jew, atheist, etc with your current moral system then I would still find you just as loathsome. And just because you hate all blacks/Muslims/etc due to the actions of a few does not mean that the rest of us are going to judge Catholics and Catholicism by your horrible example.

[Ben Kenobi]

And just because you hate all blacks/Muslims/etc

Why do you hate Catholics, Loinburger? What did they ever do to you?

Also paragraphs are your friends.

I believe that the Catholic church has made many mistakes, but I am hopeful that they will continue to be acknowledged and rectified

Do you believe the teachings of the Catholic charch on gay marriage is a 'mistake' that needs to be 'rectified'?

[giblets]

Is Ben fuсked up because his mother regrets giving birth to him or does his mother regret giving birth to him because he's fuсked up?

[loinburger]

Do you believe the teachings of the Catholic charch on gay marriage is a 'mistake' that needs to be 'rectified'?

Several of my family members oppose gay marriage. If we have a conversation on the subject it goes something like this:

loin's family member: I'm against gay marriage, I think that marriage should be between a man and a woman
loin: I'm fine with gay marriage, I don't think it really matters what the participants' genders are
lfm: Okay
loin: Okay

And there you have it, there's really nothing to debate - they believe in one definition of marriage, I believe in another, the end.

Now here's what a "debate" with you is like

Ben: I'm against gay marriage because gays are all pedophiles
loin: What? Do you have statistics for that or something?
Ben: Oh, so you support pedophilia now, is that what you're saying?
loin: Well, you made a claim, so I asked you to back it up.
Ben: Fine, here's an article about a gay guy who was a pedophile, QED.
loin: That doesn't prove anything except that the one guy was a pedophile.
Ben: Do you have any proof that all gay people aren't pedophiles? I thought not. QED.

Do you see the difference? My family members (and most of the other Catholics I've met who oppose gay marriage) believe that the definition of marriage is between one man and one woman: they say as much and that's the end of it, because that's the entire debate in a nutshell - the definition of marriage. Maybe they also hate homosexuals, but if they do then they recognize that this is a moral failing on their part and so it doesn't enter into the conversation. If all you did was argue your opinion about the definition of marriage then you'd get a lot less flak, certainly from me; instead you throw around slanderous accusations about the moral failings of homosexuals even though this is completely irrelevant to the topic of the definition of marriage - it's just your hate leaking out.

[Ben Kenobi]

And there you have it, there's really nothing to debate - they believe in one definition of marriage, I believe in another, the end.

That really wasn't my question, Loinburger. I know you support gay marriage. Do you see the Church's teachings on gay marriage as a mistake that should be rectified?

I think it's funny that you're complaining about your statements being mirrored, loin. If you don't like it why do you do it to other people?

slanderous accusations about the moral failings of homosexuals

Ah. So what pisses you off is when I cite statistics showing that gay and lesbians are more likely to abuse their partners.

That ain't slander, Loin. It's an uncomfortable truth. I'm sorry you don't like truth, but you're perfectly willing to cite similar stats when it supports your argument. What's the problem when I use your exact same tactics?

[loinburger]

That really wasn't my question, Loinburger. I know you support gay marriage. Do you see the Church's teachings on gay marriage as a mistake that should be rectified?

I think it's funny that you're complaining about your statements being mirrored, loin. If you don't like it why do you do it to other people?

The Catholic church can define marriage however it wants, I don't particularly care - we don't live in a theocracy, so the church's opinion is irrelevant. The Church of Satan supports polygamy, I'm fine with that too because it's just as irrelevant as the Catholic definition of marriage.

Ah. So what pisses you off is when I cite statistics showing that gay and lesbians are more likely to abuse their partners.

That ain't slander, Loin. It's an uncomfortable truth. I'm sorry you don't like truth, but you're perfectly willing to cite similar stats when it supports your argument. What's the problem when I use your exact same tactics?

1. As has already been pointed out in this thread, the study you cited actually proves the exact opposite of what you thought it proved
2. The study you cited is irrelevant to the issue of child abuse
3. You are only willing to apply statistics when attacking homosexuals - you dismissed statistics that African-Americans are more likely to commit child abuse because apparently you hate homosexuals more than you hate blacks
4. You are all too willing to condemn entire groups for the actions of a few of its members - except when you're in the group that's been misbehaving

How about this: if you say that you believe that group punishment is a grand idea, then I'll put you on ignore forever and ever because there's really not much point in my continuing to attempt to converse with you. If you don't believe that group punishment is a grand idea, then stop advocating for the application of group punishment to groups that you dislike.

[Sava]

Knowledgable, yes - you often make false claims, and I learn something when I look for the truth in the matter. Moral, yes - you're a good example of what not to be; occasionally when I find myself becoming angry with somebody/something I think of you and realize how empty a life of hate would be.

This.

Loin

[Sava]

Is Ben fuсked up because his mother regrets giving birth to him or does his mother regret giving birth to him because he's fuсked up?

Yes

[Ben Kenobi]

The Catholic church can define marriage however it wants, I don't particularly care - we don't live in a theocracy, so the church's opinion is irrelevant. The Church of Satan supports polygamy, I'm fine with that too because it's just as irrelevant as the Catholic definition of marriage.

Curious. What then are the mistakes that the Catholic church has done that you think ought to be rectified if gay marriage is not one of them?

You are only willing to apply statistics when attacking homosexuals

And you're only willing to cite statistics that help your argument. Why is this dishonest argument tactics that are reprehensible when it's me, when everyone here does the exact same thing? It's not dishonest. It's simple debate tactics. I don't get upset and scream, "dishonest" when someone uses proper argument tactics against me. I expect it.

What I think you're shocked at is that someone is doing what you are used to do to them. And you expect to get away with it because you feel that consensus is on your side so you can shout me down.

You still haven't actually answered a simple yes or no question.

[loinburger]

Curious. What then are the mistakes that the Catholic church has done that you think ought to be rectified if gay marriage is not one of them?

I am not going to let you sidetrack this any further. My opinions about the Catholic church, except as they pertain to the Church's stance on marriage, are not relevant to this discussion.

And you're only willing to cite statistics that help your argument. Why is this dishonest argument tactics that are reprehensible when it's me, when everyone here does the exact same thing? It's not dishonest. It's simple debate tactics. I don't get upset and scream, "dishonest" when someone uses proper argument tactics against me. I expect it.

What I think you're shocked at is that someone is doing what you are used to do to them. And you expect to get away with it because you feel that consensus is on your side so you can shout me down.

You still haven't actually answered a simple yes or no question.

Where have I cited statistics in favor of gay marriage? Please link to at least one post.

I have cited statistics in an attempt to show you that your statistics were bull**** and/or to demonstrate that you would ignore any statistics that you didn't like. At no point have I cited any statistics about how homosexuals make better parents or anything like that, because they would be completely irrelevant to the discussion.

Do you believe that group punishment is appropriate?

[Berzerker]

he does if they're pot smokers

[loinburger]

It makes a difference to me whether he implicitly or explicitly advocates group punishment - in the former case he's an idiot and it's possible that he can be de-idioted ("gosh I didn't realize that what I was saying amounted to group punishment"), but in the latter case he's hopelessly evil.

[giblets]

He'll probably waffle some more and keep saying it's "rational" to be racist if a black person robbed you