what happened to the großrossiya thread

[Ellestar]

What is meant by "unnatural way"?

Google translate:

Expert opinion number 36 of 31/07/2015 was determined that the citizen found OSOBA_3 minor injuries: wounds in the anal area, which could be formed from 7.9.2015, the action and blunt objects classified as minor bodily harm causing intermittent health disorder 'I. Bodily injury as a wound in the anus could be formed from a single administration of a blunt hard object (penis) of the rectum.

[Aeson]

Yeah, but that's just a propaganda peace about a country in general. Now an actual assassin puts the blame personally on the president, and more importantly, he says that it's done not so to fight crime (activity that is more or less supported by the people), but to kill opponents of the president. So, it's a scheme to undermine president's credibility.

... which started BEFORE Duterte said anything about Obama, and even BEFORE Duterte was president. Duterte running for president was where these issues popped back up, after having been lower key issues for over a decade. This SPECIFIC WITNESS was making these claims BEFORE Duterte was even elected! Blaming it on some sort of blowback for a recent comment about Obama is IGNORANT OF HOW TIME FUNCTIONS.

[BeBMan]

How come he did not poison Obama last week?



Is Obama immune?

Putin is looking up to Obama.

[Ellestar]

... which started BEFORE Duterte said anything about Obama, and even BEFORE Duterte was president. Duterte running for president was where these issues popped back up, after having been lower key issues for over a decade. This SPECIFIC WITNESS was making these claims BEFORE Duterte was even elected! Blaming it on some sort of blowback for a recent comment about Obama is IGNORANT OF HOW TIME FUNCTIONS.

Ok, didn't know about it

[Ellestar]

https://www.welt.de/geschichte/zweiter-weltkrieg/article158067273/Stalins-spektakulaere-Demuetigung-der-Wehrmachtsfahnen.html

Now, we were supposed to respect Nazi flags? They killed 26 millions of our civilians and planned to kill at least 100 million more. That's not an army, that's a bunch of murderers and slavers (they planned to enslave the ones they don't kill). Can anyone possibly respect such an army?

Seriously, sometimes western propaganda goes waaaay out of whack.

[BeBMan]

Putin has a small penis:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Putin

[Proteus_MST]

https://www.welt.de/geschichte/zweit...htsfahnen.html

Now, we were supposed to respect Nazi flags? They killed 26 millions of our civilians and planned to kill at least 100 million more. That's not an army, that's a bunch of murderers and slavers (they planned to enslave the ones they don't kill). Can anyone possibly respect such an army?

Seriously, sometimes western propaganda goes waaaay out of whack.

Some of your fellow russian citizens respect them even today



(as do idiots in other countries, including germany, as well, of course ... even Israel has its Neonazis ... "funny" enough usually children of immigrants from russia/former USSR)

(as for the behavior of the soldiers, I have to say that it is interesting to have a russian point the finger at the german soldiers ... considering that the treatment of "liberated populace" by the soviet soldiers cannot be called "better":_

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_war_crimes#World_War_II

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_during_the_liberation_of_Poland

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_d...ion_of_Germany ...
honestly, if I were someone (however, especially a woman) in occupied territorxy in WW2, I would prefer to be "liberated" neither from the germans nor the soviets ... and would rather do everything I can in order to get into "liberated terrain" occupied by the americans or french )

[Ellestar]

(as for the behavior of the soldiers, I have to say that it is interesting to have a russian point the finger at the german soldiers ... considering that the treatment of "liberated populace" by the soviet soldiers cannot be called "better":_

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_war_crimes#World_War_II

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_during_the_liberation_of_Poland

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_d...ion_of_Germany ...

Yeah, yeah, i know that rumor, thank you. But Germans killed like 300+ times more USSR civilians than USSR killed German civilians (and most civilian losses are probably inevitable losses in city fights). And other Allies countries actually killed more German civilians than USSR did.

So the facts are that Soviet soldiers didn't intentionally kill German civilians in any noticeable numbers, so where these stories of rape come from, if Soviet soldiers weren't like German soldiers?

honestly, if I were someone (however, especially a woman) in occupied territorxy in WW2, I would prefer to be "liberated" neither from the germans nor the soviets ... and would rather do everything I can in order to get into "liberated terrain" occupied by the americans or french )

If i honestly thought that Soviet soldiers will do the same to German civilians that German soldiers did to the Soviet civilans, i would have thought so too and would have tried to run. And given that most people honestly believe that other people are just as good or as bad as them, that should be what most Germans thought. So that's not even an argument.

And the same False-consensus effect probably makes you think that Soviet soldiers were like German soldiers, even when there is no evidence. But it's only the German soldiers who had a blanket permission to do whatever crime they want against Soviet civilians: "German soldiers who commit crimes against humanity, the USSR and prisoners of war are to be exempted from criminal responsibility, even if they commit acts punishable according to German law."

[Proteus_MST]

Yeah, yeah, i know that rumor, thank you. But Germans killed like 300+ times more USSR civilians than USSR killed German civilians (and most civilian losses are probably inevitable losses in city fights). And other Allies countries actually killed more German civilians than USSR did.

So the facts are that Soviet soldiers didn't intentionally kill German civilians in any noticeable numbers, so where these stories of rape come from, if Soviet soldiers weren't like German soldiers?

If i honestly thought that Soviet soldiers will do the same to German civilians that German soldiers did to the Soviet civilans, i would have thought so too and would have tried to run. And given that most people honestly believe that other people are just as good or as bad as them, that should be what most Germans thought. So that's not even an argument.

And the same False-consensus effect probably makes you think that Soviet soldiers were like German soldiers, even when there is no evidence. But it's only the German soldiers who had a blanket permission to do whatever crime they want against Soviet civilians: "German soldiers who commit crimes against humanity, the USSR and prisoners of war are to be exempted from criminal responsibility, even if they commit acts punishable according to German law."

Perhaps you should check the links I gave to you.
This isn't "just" about atrocities regarding german civilians, but includes other countries as well.

Examples:
Estonia:

More than 300,000 citizens of Estonia, almost a third of the population at the time, were affected by deportations, arrests, execution and other acts of repression.^[32] As a result of the Soviet takeover,^{[clarification needed]} Estonia permanently lost at least 200,000 people or 20% of its population to repression, exodus and war
...
In 1941, to implement Stalin's scorched earth policy, destruction battalions were formed in the western regions of the Soviet Union. In Estonia, they killed thousands of people including a large proportion of women and children, while burning down dozens of villages, schools and public buildings.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_war_crimes#Estonia

Poland (after the first invasion, when Stalin was allied with Hitler ... before the german-soviet war):

Torture was used on a wide scale in various prisons, especially those in small towns. Prisoners were scalded with boiling water in Bobrka; in Przemyslany, people had their noses, ears, and fingers cut off and eyes put out; in Czortkow, female inmates had their breasts cut off; and in Drohobycz, victims were bound together with barbed wire.^[49] Similar atrocities occurred in Sambor, Stanislawow, Stryj, and Zloczow.^[49] According to historian, Prof. Jan T. Gross:

We cannot escape the conclusion: Soviet state security organs tortured their prisoners not only to extract confessions but also to put them to death. Not that the NKVD had sadists in its ranks who had run amok; rather, this was a wide and systematic procedure. — Jan T. Gross^[49]

According to sociologist, Prof. Tadeusz Piotrowski, during the years 1939–41, nearly 1.5 million inhabitants of the Soviet-controlled areas of former eastern Poland were deported, of whom 63.1% were Poles or other nationalities and 7.4% were Jews. Only a small number of these deportees survived the war and returned.^[50] According to American professor Carroll Quigley, at least one third of the 320,000 Polish prisoners of war captured by the Red Army in 1939 were murdered.^[51]

And after polands "liberation" from Nazi germany by the soviets:

The attitude of Soviet servicemen towards ethnic Poles was better than towards the Germans, but not entirely. The scale of rape of Polish women in 1945 led to a pandemic of sexually transmitted diseases. Although the total number of victims remains a matter of guessing, the Polish state archives and statistics of the Ministry of Health indicate that it might have exceeded 100,000

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_war_crimes#Poland

Likewise very interesting is the account of the yugoslavian politician Djilas. When he and Tito complained to the chief of the soviet military mission about the rape of yugoslavian women, Djilas was summoned directly to a very angry Stalin ... who (among other things) told him:

... Djilas, of whom I could least have expected such a thing, a man whom I received so well! And an Army which did not spare its blood for you! Does Djilas, who is himself a writer, not know what human suffering and the human heart are? Can't he understand it if a soldier who has crossed thousands of kilometers through blood and fire and death has fun with a woman or takes some trifle?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_war_crimes#Yugoslavia

So, for Stalin raping women was just "having some fun" and "taking some trifle".
If even the highest soviet leader has this opinion of raping women (and often even young girls), I really doubt that the soviet officers were very eager in persecuting rapes by their soldiers.

But lets just read the account of a female member of the soviet troops about the usual behavior of her unit upon conquering german towns:

When we occupied every town, we had first three days for looting and ... [rapes]. That was unofficial of course. But after three days one could be court-martialed for doing this. ... I remember one raped German woman laying naked, with hand grenade between her legs. Now I feel shame, but I did not feel shame back then... Do you think it was easy to forgive [the Germans]? We hated to see their clean undamaged white houses. With roses. I wanted them to suffer. I wanted to see their tears. ... Decades had to pass until I started feeling pity for them

Likewise a soviet army officer also doesn't write anything about soldiers getting punished (which lets one assume that the unofficial granting of 3 days of allowed looting and raping was a rather widerspread practice):

We were young, strong, and four years without women. So we tried to catch German women and ... Ten men raped one girl. There were not enough women; the entire population run from the Soviet Army. So we had to take young, twelve or thirteen year-old. If she cried, we put something into her mouth. We thought it was fun. Now I can not understand how I did it. A boy from a good family... But that was me.^[45]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_during_the_occupation_of_Germany#Soviet_literature

Nope ... surely not less barbaric than the germans.


This also is the case for the soviet treatment of POWs after the war ... where 25-35% of the 2.5-3 million german POWs died in soviet Gulags, due to being overworked, malnutrition and torture.
One of the people who died in a soviet concentration camp was btw. Wilm Hosenfeld ... a german Wehrmacht officer whose name is inscribed in Yad Vashem among the "Righteous of the nations", because, just like Oscar Schindler, he did everything in his capacity to save jews and polish people.
Despite a jew pleading for his release, he was kept in a soviet concentration camp till 1952, when he died as a result of the torture by the soviets.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilm_Hosenfeld

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3334954/The-good-Nazi-Courageous-story-guilt-wracked-German-officer-saved-Pianist-inspired-Hollywood-blockbuster.html

I assume, in contrast to german concentration camp guardians, not a single soviet Gulag guardian (or officer) ever was put to trial for the mistreatment of the inmates

[Bereta_Eder]

A good nazi is a dead nazi

[rah]

I'm sure a nazi would say the same about a Russian, Greek or liberal. It's all a matter of perspective if you actively pursue death for those you dislike. Sad.

[Bereta_Eder]

He's welcomed to say it.
Actually he put it into practise too

[Bereta_Eder]

As has become abundandly clear on this thread americans are simply.... far away from reality

[Bereta_Eder]

I went with the SO at a remote village one of the few that had nazi attrocities.

There was a museum there.

A large plaque that read: "Greeks don't resist, if what you want is what we want we will have no problems"

It appears that there was resistance.
Then the nazis rounded up everyone all male people of that small village, children and men and executed them.

They made them walk outside of a school and shot them dead.

The village was awashed with cries of desperation from that senseless slaughter.

The greeks (AND THE YUGOSLAVS) for some peculiar reason put up a gruesome fight against an enemy, to whom they had done nothing.

Imagine being at home and some ****ing german coming and killing your family.

For nothing.

[rah]

When in doubt just kill them.
Are you pro death penalty?

I'm not saying what they did wasn't atrocious. But if you kill everyone that was ever related or who's ancestors had ever committed an evil act, there wouldn't be many left alive on the planet. This is how genocide usually starts. The cycle just continues.