Supreme Court rules in favor of public legislative prayers

[kentonio]

If you hold me at gunpoint, it's coercion because there's the threat of violence (i.e. force). If you just feel like you need to say the Pledge to fit in, nobody is coercing you. You're just a weak willed wuss.

Let me guess, you're one of those people who also thinks bullying should be encouraged to make kids tougher right?

[Felch]

I think bullying is cowardly and distasteful, but I also think that it's a part of life. As long as there are cowards, those cowards will gather together to pick on people they think are weak. Rules won't put an end to it, they'll just force the cowards to be more clever and subtle about bullying. People need to be ready to handle that sort of situation.

More to the point, I think people who are afraid to stand up for what they believe in make lousy citizens. If people truly oppose saying the Pledge, then they should stick to their position in spite of whatever social harm it does them. It won't always be easy to stand by your ideals, and it's good for people to learn this lesson when the stakes are at their lowest.

[Sava]

Berz: Considering there was prayer at the Constitutional Convention, maybe it would not have been as crazy with the Founders as you think .

there was also a lot of booze

and probably hookers

[Sava]

This subject is hilarious.

I love how people rush to defend what is literally wasted time by government officials.

But slap "god" on anything, and it's okay, right?

[Felch]

Ain't no party like a Constitutional Convention PARTY!

[Sava]

Ain't no party like a Constitutional Convention PARTY!

woooooo

party like its 1787!



so yeah, everyone who isn't a white, land owning, protestant male.... GTFO!

[regexcellent]

Let's be serious, the government officials of Greece, NY aren't doing anything of importance anyway. It's a tiny-ass suburb and part of Monroe County which handles most of its actual important government functions.

[AAAAAAAAH!]

It's tough being an atheist when so many atheists are annoying preachy ****heads who care and get upset about all the wrong things.

Being a little preachy aren't you?

[Sava]

Let's be serious, the government officials of Greece, NY aren't doing anything of importance anyway. It's a tiny-ass suburb and part of Monroe County which handles most of its actual important government functions.

Awfully quick to act apologist for government waste

[MrFun]

How are you being coerced into doing something that the law says you don't have to do?

The law says that it is illegal to coerce anyone into participating in prayer that is against their belief.

But other individuals, in violation of another person's rights or in violation of law, can still coerce someone even if the law does not itself force prayer participation on everyone.

But as you said in another post here, any victim of such coercion can take it to court. But as long as any government body (local, county, state, or federal) make appearances in favoring Christianity over any other belief, telling a victim that they can just "take it to court" puts the onus on the victim while encouraging others to pressure or even coerce others to participate in prayer.

[Ben Kenobi]

The law says that it is illegal to coerce anyone into participating in prayer that is against their belief.

Oh, so is this why you justify your witch hunt against anyone who signed Proposition 8?

[Ben Kenobi]

It aint their time, aint their property, aint their religious freedom.

You don't have to check your faith at the door, Berz.

If you're taking my $$$ to pay for your religion it aint religious freedom.

If you're going to use the state apparatus to ban mine, then no deal. Also, your state is attempting to force me to pay for contraception. Do you support that, Berz?

None that I can see, maybe you should re-read what I said.

Then there's no coercion.

How does a Christian swear an oath when Jesus told people not to swear oaths?

Theologically, there's an issue, I agree. But constitutionally, requiring an oath of loyalty isn't prohibited. Remember the Ironclad oath?

I agree, can we get back to our debate now? The "offense" is politicians coercing children into pledging allegiance to the state's god, making me pay for it just adds injury to injury.

There's no requirement for participation in the pledge.

The fact these hypocrites cloak their immorality with the Framer's halo of religious freedom is also offensive. The Pledge was not introduced until long after they finished rolling in their graves. And it was a national socialist who gave it to us.

The real question is whether liberties can be sustained in the face of a government deprived of Christian influences.

Apparently there is no connection between liberty and Christianity. Do you believe this, Berz?

[Sava]

The crux of the matter is:

Should government waste have an exemption for religion?

You are either pro-efficient-government or pro-religion. Pick a side.

[The Mad Monk]

Because having to take government to court (be it local or federal) is not something most people would consider a reasonable option. If I hold you up at gunpoint, is that not coercion either because you can take me to court over it?

Taking the government to court is what we do. All. The. Time.

[kentonio]

Taking the government to court is what we do. All. The. Time.

How many times have you taken the government to court so far?